Aggressive Progressives: April 20, 2017

In Aggressive Progressives - On Demand, Membership by Gigi Manukyan200 Comments

Jimmy Dore, Malcolm Fleschner, and Steve Oh on a special 4/20 episode of Aggressive Progressives.

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  2. Totally agree with Malcolm & Steve on Bernie’s role in the Unity Tour. I had the same reaction & thoughts when I saw the Chris Hayes interview. Bernie really showed the obvious flaws in Tom Perez & the DNC so wake up people, hope & change is not a platform! . Bernie is too strong & too smart to be made to look small by Perez.

  3. I have two new heroes thanks to this show: Clarence Darrow and Melissa Mays from Flint. Thanks, Aggressive Progressives!

  7. I see Jimmy’s side. I agree with the danger of having Bernie standing on stage with the corruption. For some, it could lead to a misinterpretation of where the DNC stands on Bernie’s policies. It makes me angry. I want Bernie to tell them to pound sand!

    Although, I also see Malcolm and Steve’s point. I hate that Bernie agreed to the Unity Tour; however, the thought has crossed my mind numerous times that Bernie is expanding his support by this tour, as well as his town hall meetings. Sitting next to Perez during an interview shines a blatant light on the difference between their positions. For people that could not see it before, there is no denying the circumlocution of Perez especially when it is followed by the candidness of Bernie. The problem is that not everyone saw that interview and I heard people applauding Perez later during his speech.

    It’s my hope that Bernie plans to start a 3rd party but wants to gain as much attention with his message as possible and show how hard he has been willing to work with both sides before he leaps into the sabotage that will come with him leading a 3rd party. What he has accomplished since Trump has gotten into office has strengthened his base of supporters and gained him more momentum. In my opinion, I think he’s gone as far as he needs to with this effort.

    Now, it’s time for him to lead a People’s Party.

  8. Oh how I’ve been missing TYT and AP on my month long travels thru China…I am unable to watch the shows online and most of the web based USA news sites are BLOCKED :( I also missed Bernie’s U.T. in Phoenix….I am going thru serious withdrawels. It is frusterating though the comments offer some small concilation. Peace out!

    1. I see Jimmy’s side. I agree with the danger of having Bernie standing on stage with the corruption. For some, it could lead to a misinterpretation of where the DNC stands on Bernie’s policies. It makes me angry. I want Bernie to tell them to pound sand!

      Although, I also see Malcolm and Steve’s point. I hate that Bernie agreed to the Unity Tour; however, the thought has crossed my mind numerous times that Bernie is expanding his support by this tour, as well as his town hall meetings. Sitting next to Perez during an interview shines a blatant light on the difference between their positions. For people that could not see it before, there is no denying the circumlocution of Perez especially when it is followed by the candidness of Bernie. The problem is that not everyone saw that interview and I heard people applauding Perez later during his speech.

      It’s my hope that Bernie plans to start a 3rd party but wants to gain as much attention with his message as possible and show how hard he has been willing to work with both sides before he leaps into the sabotage that will come with him leading a 3rd party. What he has accomplished since Trump has gotten into office has strengthened his base of supporters and gained him more momentum. In my opinion, I think he’s gone as far as he needs to with this effort.

      Now, it’s time for him to lead a People’s Party.

  9. The DNC will never get Bernie’s e-mail list. I also believe that he’s letting Tom Perez to twist in the wind as he should. They have tried to use him, but I think he’s really using them, and by showing the Democratic Party for what it is, a bunch of empty suits.

  10. “The self-lobotomizing of Congress is one of the chief reasons why the executive branch, and behind it the Deep State of contractors, lobbyists and think-tank experts, has filled the void of decision making in Washington.” -Mike Lofgren, The Deep State/The Fall of the Constitution and the rise of a Shadow Government, Penguin Books, 2016.

    1. I think Bernie is continuing to be the honest politician he’s always been. In an honest argument, Bernie’s side will always win. Jimmy sees too much opposition that isn’t really there, such as when he brought on that sweet, naiive lady that gave platitudes instead of policies…he accused her of “gaslighting” him. No, Jimmy, you’re wrong. You’re seeing too many enemies. Not everybody sees everything. People aren’t evil if they’re mistaken, and that’s an error you’ve be making lately.

  12. Agreed, chetzmom. Please stop with the hidden 3D strategy arguments. Local news optics matter more. Democrats still don’t get it. Hello; messaging! What message does Bernie think he’s sending to disillusioned red and purple state voters by doing this unity tour?

    Trump took the Republican nomination and rode it to a win in the general election by railing against the Republican party and picking fights with Fox News. The most popular politician in America thinks a unity tour with a Democratic party leader eliciting major boos from the audience is a winning message to lure the angry voters who gave us Trump? Does he think this motivates his Progressive base, or inspires non-voters to get involved in grassroots politics in these red states they are touring?

    The Republicans and Independents I know who considered voting for Bernie in 2016 are not sitting around talking about how smart Bernie is for playing 3D chess with the DNC. They see the 10 second local news bites of people booing the leader of the DNC and say “Bernie is so stupid for sticking with the losers. No matter how bad Trump is, hey, he won.” These are people who voted to oust the 7 term head of elections in the state’s largest county, and “America’s toughest sheriff” both long serving Republicans who had been in office a combined 56 years! Why? You think they figured out Obama’s 3D chess moves and got on board with the Democratic party? No. They saw 10 second local news bites of the head of elections blaming voters for insanely long lines at the polls causing mass disenfranchisement during the primaries, and they saw too many clips of parents crying about the sheriff not investigating hundreds of cases of cimes against children while using scarce county resources to harass immigrants and waste taxpayer dollars settling case after case of civil rights violations against unconvicted people being held in county lock up for being poor or mentally ill. Party line Democrats didn’t get these Republicans out of office. It took a certain number of Trump voters to vote against the Republican party in local races.

    You can choose not to believe it but I’ve seen proof. Republicans are just as sick of incompetence and corruption as Progressives are, but how is Bernie speaking to this when he comes to a red state like AZ? He encourages everyone to unify with the incompetent and corrupt leadership of the Democratic party. Way to go, Bernie!

    Democrats are always horrible at messaging. Is Bernie falling into the same trap with this unity tour? Final thought. I’m a Progressive in a red state just visited by the unity tour last Friday. Back in 2016 I watched the Democratic primary debates with some hard line Republicans who stood up and cheered when Bernie said the business model of Wall Street is fraud. They shouted “you know it!” when he said the two party system is corrupt with big money donors buying politicians. Hey, Bernie! Back to the messaging. It’s the corruption, stupid!

  13. I agree with Malcolm, and suspected this was the case when Cenk was covering the story on the main show the other day.

    I definitely think Tom Perez is _trying_ to use Bernie to get people back into the fold, but I suspect that this might be Bernie just trusting the voters that if you get both a representative of “what is” and “what could be,” and get people to hear Tom Perez choke on his face when trying to answer what the Dems stand for, then Bernie doesn’t have to risk inflaming people by going after him or the democratic party directly.

    It’s been a while since we’ve seen actual political ju-jitsu on display, but I think that’s what’s happening.

  14. If Bernie pointed his finger at Perez he would be jettisoned and not get the platform he has now. This way he can give Perez and tge DNC a rope to hang himself with and hope that his support dwindles to the point that him and his ilk die out.

  15. Jimmy and Steve can you Mention Rosyln Layton @RoslynLayton PHD is a terrible Internet lobbyist who just said
    “US, EU, Slovenia and now Netherlands say zero rating is ok. What gives @CRTCeng? Sorry Canada, now you’re in the class with backward India.”

    Please give her a few words on the behalf of your Canadian Supporters if you can

  16. If you look at who is actually showing up for this “unity” romp it’s clear Bernie is preaching to the choir. His diehard supporters are the ones filling the halls, yet in far fewer numbers than when he first announced his candidacy for President. As a relative unknown to the national stage, on July 18, 2015 over 11,000 people packed the Phoenix Convention Center in a red state of the Southwest to hear Bernie throw down against the Democratic establishment. I was there for the same reason everybody else came. To call out the Democratic establishment for selling out working people for the past 40 years. Finally someone was going to run for President on a platform of concrete policies targeted at helping working people tossed overboard by the party decades ago! Fast forward 16 months to November 6, 2016. Bernie barely filled a high school gym the Sunday before the general election when he tried to rally support in Phoenix for Clinton-Kaine. I was there that day, too. It was a sad and pathetic thing to see. Bernie’s message about putting working people first had not changed a bit. It was simply rendered impotent as a rallying cry for backing the very corporate sellouts the 11,000 came to do away with at the convention center in 2015. That’s the problem with the “unity” tour. Last Friday night I chose to pass and watch this effort from home, despite getting multiple email requests from “Our Revlution” to show up and support Bernie’s call for unity. I couldn’t bring myself to do it when over 3,000 others did. The dwindling number of enthusiastic attendees speaks volumes. I guess I’m more in agreement with Jimmy. Even if you believe Bernie is playing a game of Stratego with the DNC, what he’s not doing is energizing his previously large and enthusiastic Progressive base. He’s diluting his message with this establishment Kool-Aid (unity) that most of us refuse to drink. We can’t find the logic in unifying with members of the Democratic establishment in order to do away with them. In a red state like AZ the end game should be about appealing to voters who quit voting for Democrats a generation ago, and bringing young first time voters to the polls. The campaign that succeeded in doing that in AZ last November was Trump, not Clinton-Kaine-Sanders. That’s what we are up against in red states. Disillusioned working class voters see a guy like Bernie as going along with the corruption of the Democratic party when he pushes for party unity. This leaves a void for someone equally as corrupt to come get these voters as long as they come with a populist message. Trump won the Presidency by stealing Bernie’s message and running with it in states where everyone is fed up with the 2 party system and Democrats have failed to deliver to their voters for over a generation. How does a Democratic party unity tour fix this? When Bernie can explain the mixed message he is giving by staying an Independent himself while asking the rest of us to unify under the Democratic party, maybe I’ll buy in. Until then deal me out.

    1. The trouble is most people do not have the time or interest in following what is going on with the Democrats drama. During the election, even w/MSM working hard against him, people somehow found out about Bernie & his message. Even some Republicans, thought, “Hey, I kinda like that guy.”

      To watch Bernie next to Perez is heartbreaking.
      I am sick to fucking death of people saying the Progressives are the ones that have to go along with the DNC/Clintoncrats!!!
      So I agree with you that it LOOKS like Bernie is bending to the DNC’s will.
      Ellison looks like a neutered Progressive Lapdog. This Unity Tour & commission (overloaded w/corporate whores) is a joke to continue the NeoLibs strangle hold on the Dem Party. No one buys the “slow & easy, wins the race” anymore.

      I never doubt Bernie’s sincerity. I believe he thinks change can come from within the Dem Party. He thinks he can change the Establishment Dems to his thinking, which will NEVER happen.

      But he is NOT playing “three-dimensional chess.”
      We already heard that shit about Obama and it was a giant LIE.

    2. Like Progressive Alternative on FB. Let’s all work together to give our govt back to the people…

    3. Like Progressive Alternative on Facebook and Twitter.
      We will be holding a rally 4 Peace and Anti-Establishment rally Saturday April 29, courthouse square Scranton PA from 4-7. Like us on FB… #progressivealternative

    4. MrsG and chetzmom, I think you both are making some great points. I think for people paying more attention, putting more time into digging in the news, maybe the contrast between Bernie and Perez is showing itself pretty stark, but for the majority of people, everyday people, who are not immersed in the news, party analysis, party drama, etc, it makes sense that they would be significantly turned off seeing Bernie up there with establishment mouthpieces. You all are saying it better than I. I really think that if Bernie did an about face and agreed to work with Nick Brana’s strategy for a new party it would redeem him in many people’s minds, and at the same time he could say, “Hey, I gave it my best shot with the Democratic Party, and they totally blew it.” It could possibly in the long term, if he started a new party, give him even more foundation when people saw that he first made a full on effort with the Dems and exposed that it was they, not he, that forced the situation of him starting a new party that would destroy the Dems and give us a real choice. I don’t think he intended for his efforts with the Dems to not yield any fruit, though. Maybe he could make lemonade out of the current bushel of lemons being doled out…it will be interesting to see how this all plays out.

  17. Keep fighting guys! Screw those rich cockmunchers who DO NOT give a flyin fuck about us AT ALL. These Clinton led corporatist whores need our dissent at every turn. Never forget either that Bernie has been at this since forever. He knows what he’s doing.

  18. Bernie has always just done what is necessary to get his bills passed. If this unity tour gets Perez to help him get things through, he’s doing it for that. Everyone knows what Bernie stands for, including Perez. I think the tarnishing goes both ways. People who hear “Unity tour with Perez and Sanders.” Will either go watch for Bernie or think “Eww, Bernie’s with Perez now.” People don’t read past the headlines. All those through the Hilary campaign showed that. On the other hand, anyone who watches it will see Perez flounder and fail and be a total schlub and know Bernie is better.

    1. As for what I think about if Sanders is playing chess or simply trying to save his namesake as a politician, I would’ve leaned toward the latter before this show. Now I’m thinking perhaps Sanders is a much more cunning politician than we realized.

      Not sharing his email list, not actively trying to piggyback Perez’s bullshit to the audience, but instead making his claims obviously clear and simple to as many Americans as possible before 2020, take this into account with his 75%+ approval rating in his home state, he’s got one the most secure seats in the entire House, and he’s using it as best he can to prop himself up for another bid in the next cycle.

      If he went off the hinges like Jimmy says he should (and many agree with), I don’t find it unreasonable to assume that the Corporate Media would black him out as an official “radical lefty”. By not cutting the party in half immediately, he’s getting as much exposure to the other (corporate) side of his own party as he can on his opponents dime and time. If he stays in the spotlight (presumably harder with the Corporate Media at odds with your new party), then his approval rating will stay solid nationwide like it has locally for the past 40 years, and he’ll possess just as much (if not more) authority to strip the Dems of power in 2018-2020.

      I think this is his way of playing the media for access so that, when the time comes, to choose between Prpgressive and Establishment the choices and sides are clear enough for even the average voter to tell the clear difference.

      As Jimmy Dore regularly says, the Establishment Dems are more dangerous than Repubs because they’re wolves in sheeps’ clothing. Sanders is shaving the sheep.

  19. I think Malcolm is right. A lot of Bernie’s followers may not support his political calculus, but they still believe in his platform and won’t desert him any time soon. Bernie needs the support of moderate Dems, the older Dems who watch MSNBC and voted for Hillary. My mom watches MSNBC religiously. I’ve tried explaining the different between progressive and corporatist Dems, but she hasn’t really gotten it. Segments like this *show* her what I’m talking about when I say, “the DNC doesn’t care about its constituents.” It also gets him out and around the country where he can spread his message and pick up new supporters.

    I think he thought this through very thoroughly, and I believe that was a large factor in his decision.

  20. Goddammit Jimmy, stop making every single fucking thing about you and your opinionabout Obama and Hillary.
    You fucking asked this mother whether she voted for hillary. That could not have been less fucking relevent to Flint, poisoned water and her struggle.
    Then what was your commentary right after the interview? You talked about you and your problems with finger waggers.
    Get over your fucking self. You act as though your opinions are singular and brand new and you bathe in this idea that somehow you are both martyr and singular political genius.
    Your ideas are new to you. At first it was nice watching you become so passionate but now you let them overshadow all subjects and your judgement…You opinion of Bernie and this tour is has so little thought or reason behind it it was almost shocking.
    It is not your opinions themselves that are the problem it is your love for your own opinions and a pride for having them that is corrupting your reason.

    1. That is no way to talk about any host at TYT. Kindly show a modicum of respect, as everyone else of this by now extremely numerous group of commenters appears to be capable of doing.

      The fact is that Hillary Clinton is a perfectly appropriate footnote in any Flint interview, because:

      1) Her royal highness came down to Flint during her campaign, as part of a cynical and self-interested PR move, so obviously devoid of any real interest in the well-being of those ordinary citizens and not intending to lift a finger in terms of material support. She was there to grab the spotlight for herself, and to shore up the media position of the local and equally useless Democratic Party operatives on the ground. You seriously think that people in Flint couldn’t see that (all the moreso after she had left), or that they have ever forgotten about it?

      2) By this point in the interview, the conversation had already naturally drifted towards the subject of the useless and cynical local representatives from the Democratic Party and the DNC, which made Jimmy’s question an appropriate segway. The formulation of the question itself could have been smoother, perhaps, but the topic and the underlying engagement was totally on-point.

  21. Regards to Bernie, Malcolm and Steve are focusing on strategy of the tour and Jimmy is focusing on the optics. Both views are valid, but only Bernie really knows what’s going on inside his head. If the DNC doesn’t make a genuine flip (not likely), Bernie will have no choice but to run as a third party candidate. If he does, he will win.

  22. I believe Bernie’s playing some political Kung Fu moves right now, keeping it straight, keeping focus on the issues (for the most part), and letting the Dems fall on their own sword if they don’t change. He’s really leaving it up to them at this point. I don’t think he’s purposely trying to hurt them, but he’s making it painfully obvious where they need to go with the party. I’m convinced now that they not only will not change, but literally cannot. There is no way they can get out of their Faustian Bargain they made with big money donors and corporations. You can see all this wearing on Bernie. He has to be sensing that his efforts are not even close to getting the results he hoped for in transforming the Democratic Party into a grassroots people’s party. I’m convinced the people’s party has to come from without and can only succeed with a beloved politician. If Bernie makes that leap of faith to start a new party and take his people with him, like Lincoln did when the Republican Party come out of the Whigs, it will be a whole new ball game in the US of A.

  23. I don’t know what Bernie is doing. It’s embarrassing. I’m embarrassed for him. They shut him out, blocked him, cheated him (and by extension, ME, and the rest of you) Perez obviously does not and will not support single payer. What the actual fuck, Bernie. Lending credibility to morally bankrupt.

  24. Bernie is embarrassing Perez & establishment Democrats kindly with sustenance and compassionate ideas & values for Americans to be able to grab ahold of & progress out of the hole that was dug for them & by doing so it creates the rift that is needed to drag establishment along or risk a third party. Bernie is lucky to be offered the position on the unity tour to be able to do just that & from the looks of the outcome Sanders will be lucky to be asked on another tour.

    1. I agree with Malcolm, but I think the average viewer (not of TYT) will either be confused why Bernie says clear policies and Perez spins baloney, or think they are reinforcing each other. Useful commentary got me thinking!

  25. You guys are great, thank you for the continued insightful commentary. I also love that the show has been extended, thank you for your efforts :)

  26. I wonder if the comment system (which is not advanced, to put it mildly) has an upper limit in terms of how many comments it can handle before something breaks? Because I don’t remember us ever stress-testing it like this.

  27. I think what jimmy is missing here is, they WOULD NEVER bring up single payer if Bernie wasn’t there to say it first, and because he is saying it first, it forces tom perez to say that gobbledygook bullshit response.

    I think he does this unity tour, and come 2018, Sanders rolls out a bunch of progressives and gives that lien in the sand ultimatum to the dnc and with or without their support, people are with bernie sanders, the voters are HIS voters, and he doesnt need to stay with the DNC if they dont fall in line with him.

    I think malcom has made a sound argument here that jimmy may need a few more days to think on.

  29. I utterly agree with Malcolm and Steve. Anything that helps expose the Democratic establishment should be welcomed. It looks like the majority of people are able to see right through Tom’s BS. So if that’s the case Bernie should keep talking about Medicare for All, Fsmily paid leave, living wage, renewable energy, etc. Because this will help more people see the distinction between the establishment vs progressives.

  30. I agree with Malcolm and Steve. The only thing missing on that interview was Bernie wearing a t-shirt saying “I’m with stupid”. I’m pretty sure Bernie was trying his best not to laugh out loud. It was so obvious what was going on. The name “Unity Tour” is perfect… everybody seeing Tom Perez and Bernie will side with Bernie… united.

  31. Bernie knows exactly what he’s doing. He’s not propping them up, he’s letting them hang themselves by supplying a little rope… :)

  32. I think Bernie sees this tour as a way to continue to spread his agenda. I also feel it is a way to force Democrats in his direction. When you have people pushing back, booing everyone but Bernie, The democrats will figure out they need to pivot and follow Bernie or none of them will be elected again. Bernie knows these people are showing up for him Not Tom Perez. I feel he is showing his strength and that his agenda is what will get politicians elected not the democrat agenda.

  33. Seeing that interview the other day, I felt that Bernie looks and sounds good, with his consistent integrity, and in contrast, the parties flaws and fakeness were even more obvious.

  34. Tom Perez travelling with Bernie Sanders like the old traveling circus acts and effectively peeing on him like some trained animal is disgusting.!

    The only problem is that the wind or effective blowback is that he is peeing on himself. and the DNC.

    Bought and sold., except for Bernie.

    Economic slavery or bribery is still alive and well in the US

  35. Rather than wasting time on unity tour, why doesn’t Bernie spend his time and energy for a new party?

  36. Just got out of the tour in Vegas. Malcolm is right. There was no doubt who’s side the crowd was on. Tom got booed a lot. Bernie’s the same old g. There was no contest. Bernie’s in charge here.

  37. As Sander’s own office stated: “The goal of the tour, Sanders’s office said earlier this month, was “to begin the process of creating a Democratic Party which is strong and active in all 50 states, and a party which focuses on grassroots activism and the needs of working families.” But the tour was also meant to bridge divides between the Democratic establishment, as represented in last year’s primary by Hillary Clinton, and Sanders’s insurgent progressive wing. ”

    This paragraph exactly supports my belief that Bernie is crazy like a fox, and he is totally running the DNC henhouse ragged.

    It goes without saying that a proposal like “How about Bernie and Perez tour together so that Bernie can expose Perez and the DNC for the empty corporate vessels that they are…?” probably wouldn’t have been well received by the DNC. But the unity-sounding language in that top paragraph must have sounded like gold to the DNC. What could possibly go wrong…?

    Ha.

    And the fact is, in a round-about way what the DNC did not anticipate, Bernie is succeeding in bridging divides — to the degree that he is making the DNC Elites understand how fucked they are, unless the party makes a hard turn to the Left.

    I’m not saying he will ultimately succeed. But he is leading them on a merry chase, while simultaneously increasing his exposure and name recognition from coast to coast. Regardless of whether the DNC turns hard-left, or it refuses to turn hard-left and consequently we create a winning coalition of progressives to sweep elections in 2020… either way, the speeches, publicity, podcasts and networking that Bernie is doing right now will help further the cause.

    1. Well you just encapsulated Malcolm’s argument here, although I don’t see how quoting Sander’s press release supports your argument. Sanders usually means what he says, and says what he means. Here are the two takes right now:

      1. Malcolm: Sanders knew this would explode in Perez’s face, that the tour would end up making the DNC look bad, and thus went on the tour to create more pressure on the corporate democrats to change internally.

      2. Jimmy: Sanders wants unity in the party and there is no hidden agenda to undermine the democratic party or work against it. He believes working together with the corporate democrats is the best way forward, not working against them.

      I still am inclined to believe in Jimmy’s position here. That Sanders has in fact been trying for the last half year now, since Trump was elected, to work with, and within the Democratic party. He hasn’t been trying to undermine it. In fact, Sanders has been in lock-step with the phony Clinton corporate democrats – regarding the overblown Russia hysteria (nonsense), is on the anti-Trump bandwagon (which continues to deflect discussion on real progressive issues just as the Russia hysteria is doing), and has not forcefully been against the continued escalation and bombing in Syria (however, Sanders record on war is not as liberal as many might assume, so this is not such a surprise).

      As for providing name recognition and exposure from coast to coast. Actually, this is what Sanders is giving to Tom Perez and the DNC. He’s just given Perez a platform and a lift. The Democratic party isn’t giving it to Sanders. People need to recall – that when Sanders was running for president – the guy was literally filling stadiums when Hillary Clinton was looking to fill a basketball court (and usually was too busy anyway flying off to Wallstreet hedge fund donor dinners). It’s Sanders that is the 90 ton gorilla right now in the democratic party. A democratic party that continues to treat him like an abused wife.

    2. Excellent analysis.
      I sooooo hope that it goes how Bernie hopes it goes.

      I guess that there are still many Hillary supporters out there that Bernie is hunting for, those that still have their heads either partially or fully jammed up their butts, and he is trying to add them to the progressive collective.

      Smart strategy methinks, and one that may just produce the insight and understanding in the largest number of people. A large group that will see, understand and ultimately demand the benefits of progressive policies.

      Bernie isn’t just trying to represent those already on his side, we are already in the tank for him, but he is trying to swell our ranks even further from the heads-up-ass crowd that have, so far, been unable to see the writing on the wall that is smashing into their face.

      Good luck Bernie, I hope it works, and if it doesn’t there is always the NUCLEAR option….a new Progressive Party.

      You old fox you!

      Let’s see a Bernie FOX t-shirt in addition to those DARRROW quote t-shirts…..PLEASE TYT….PUHLEEEEAZE!

  40. I think Bernie is making the DNC look foolish, but I’m not happy he is on a unity tour with these fucks. That being said, it seems the Corporate Dems are running the campaign for party control the same way they run campaigns for elections. They’re fucked

  41. I love you Jimmy and hats off for your passion and pugnaciousness. That said… I agree with Malcolm and Steve.

    The DNC is scrambling because they thought they were going to milk Bernie’s popularity for their own benefit with the Unity Tour, but the tables have turned. In venue after venue, giant crowds rock the building with chants of “Bernie! Bernie! Bernie!” until Tom Perez/DNC is introduced and then the crowd erupts in jeers and catcalls.

    Increasingly desperate to regain the narrative, the DNC returns to the only arrow in its quiver — identity politics.

    Yesterday they put out a press release about their devotion to “right to choose” as yet another sly way to slam Bernie (for endorsing Keith Mello, which of course the DNC did also…. shhhhh!), but this is such an easy-lay-up pitch, Bernie will knock it out of the park.

    To those Berners who worry that the DNC was playing him for a sucker, just watch the Chris Hayes interview, and you will see whose message is winning. Jimmy is resisting seeing it, but its clear that Bernie is totally dominating the conversation, and winning America’s hearts and minds with his message.

    So, of course, DNC plays identity politics by staunchly declaring that the right to choose is an inviolate litmus test… Yet continues to protect the interests of their giant Health Insurance Industry donors, by insisting we must allow the insurance industry to be in charge of our health care (and don’t forget Hobby Lobby — a woman’s employer can deny her access to abortion services, too, by refusing to cover it).

    If “right to choose” is a deal-breaker, then Healthcare For All is, too.

    Women who have no access to healthcare don’t have an effective “right to choose.”

    So nice of the DNC to set this up for Bernie to knock it out of the park.

    1. You can’t know for sure, but I am hopeful that Bernie is playing the long game. If he isn’t, then we’re fucked. I am going with Steve and Malcolm as well.

    2. I’m not sure this was exactly what Jimmy was disagreeing with regarding Malcolm’s point. Although I can’t speak for Jimmy here – my take was that both Malcolm, Steve and Jimmy all agreed that the interview and indeed, it appears to be, the “Unity Tour” has turned out poorly for Perez – putting him in a poor light (in good part because of Perez’s own ineptitude IMO) and Sanders has come out better.

      I think the contention here (at least for me with Malcolm’s point) is that this was Sander’s intention all along, that he was expecting this to happen before he even committed to the tour. i.e. Sander’s had a hidden agenda to put Perez and DNC in a poor light all along by agreeing to come along with the tour and Sanders expected this would backfire on the DNC.

      At least that was my original take on Malcolm’s point. I could be wrong.

      However, I don’t believe this was Sander’s intention all along. The New Republic has an article out now by Graham Vyse where he writes:

      “The goal of the tour, Sanders’s office said earlier this month, was “to begin the process of creating a Democratic Party which is strong and active in all 50 states, and a party which focuses on grassroots activism and the needs of working families.” But the tour was also meant to bridge divides between the Democratic establishment, as represented in last year’s primary by Hillary Clinton, and Sanders’s insurgent progressive wing. ”

      So given this reported statement (coming right out of Sander’s office), and also Sander’s activities in the last few months i.e. refusing to budge an inch regarding forming a possible 3rd party entity to oppose both the Democratic and Republican parties – which IMO are both now fully corrupted and beyond repair – Sanders is continuing to attempt to fix the Democratic party from within, and is attempting to “Unify” the party himself by I assume some kind of negotiative process which includes (I assume) the Unity Commission.

      I really don’t believe Sanders wanted the outcome that just happened on the tour. He really is looking for Unity.

      But IMO, this isn’t going to happen. The party has already shut down any significant role progressives like Sanders will have with the party moving forward. That is, Perez not Ellison is leading the DNC, and the DNC has already been stacked with corporate Dems – and the DNC has already voted down any new rules that would limit big donor money and lobbying influence on its function. We see that this “Unity Commission” is also stacked with corporate Democratic picks, and has a larger majority of Clintonite Democrats in the group than Progressive Democrats. So in my view, the commission will become just as much a fruitless social engagement of progressives within the Democratic party attempting to change the minds of corporate Democrats – who will have all the power to override any and make whatever determinations they want with the commission (and likely afterward said it had been vetted with the progressives, creating a false narrative of “unity”) . Is there any precedent for this? You bettcha – look what the DNC platform committee did with most of the things Bernie Sanders and the rest of the Progressives wanted to have put in – they shot every major issue down, and kept the Democratic platform strictly corporate – mostly because of the hubris that they thought Hillary would be a shoe in for beating Trump (why Hilly also picked Tom Kaine as VP, why bother with progressives).

      In fact, this who Sanders “Unity” with the Corporate Democrats effort – is more like abusive wife syndrome. These Democrats continue to give nothing to progressives – absolutely nothing – they even gas light progressives when they can. They continue to insist Progressives are asking for too much … that we’re not being “realistic”, and that we must unite with them (which means allow them to dictate all the terms of the democratic party and remain in complete control) – we must unite with them in order to defeat Trump.

      This is the argument that Clinton was making. And the corporate Democrats have not changed one bit from their position. In fact, they’ve doubled down on the position. The Unity Tour was an attempt to corral back in more progressives using Bernie Sanders as a kind of mascot (without giving him any power) and it isn’t working.

      I think Bernie Sanders thinks or believes this is the only way change will occur. It’s more incrementalistic kind of change. The irony is, here’s a guy who was calling out for a “Revolution”. But now insists that Revolution remains within the confines of what the Establishment Democrats are willing to give or dictate. And let me tell you – they’re not willing to give much at all. In fact, I doubt they’ll do whatever it takes to marginalize and make sure nothing is given to Progressives in the future. The Corporate Democrats are about their big donors, and keeping the current lobbyists machine, corporate spending machine thriving in DC. They aren’t about principles about moving forward on concrete liberal values. Which is the paradox with Bernie – because he seems to be more about “principles.” Why he still is so loved. Yet, amazing puzzling that he seems to think his devotion to principles will help change the rottenness that has now set in within the Democratic party. I’m inclined to agree with Cenk Uygur here … Bernie may be just to nice a guy. IMO, it’s time to break up the abusive relationship, and start getting tough on the Democratic party. And the way to get tough is tough love – start moving outside the party and creating real leverage – not the phony leverage that he is getting inside the party.

    4. Nicely said Deb-N-NCAL. I agree with you 100%! Bernie has done what he’s believes is best for the people of this country (and the world) all his life; he’s not changing now.

      Have to say it again – love this show!!! Many thanks to everyone involved!

  42. I agree that Steve and Malcolm had a better view but I don’t fault Jimmy for being s stubborn asshole. he isn’t as young as he used to be, and with age you have the right to be crotchety. That doesn’t mean I quit supporting the show. Keep on fighting. I would suggest that you limit any talk about possible elections, since I don’t think you will change anything through the electoral process since you have Brutal Murderous dictators running you country and I don’t think they will relinquish power easily. You will have to work around the system, and I would suggest a Green Revolution. When you install a solar PV panel and a battery, you can achieve energy independence. You need to have a battery cope with the fluctuations in the source. I am also a proponent of small wind turbines in the right area. If you can capture any breezes, you can use the battery to store it for a calmer day. An EV is also a battery, and it will keep you free from the gasoline pump. The next time any of your go to a petroleum station, stick the nozzle up you ass and really feel what it is like to have the oil companies run your government. Just call them Gasholes. Plant an urban garden, unless you live in the
    urbs
    sub-

    A visual joke for you latin nerds. Then plant a suburban garden. Don’t vote, Revolt.

    1. The more Bernies face is seen and his message heard the better! It keeps it all alive and reminds everyone that he is not going away!

    2. Yea, Jimmy’s overly-stubborn attitude and his seeming inability to separate fact from opinion really annoy me sometimes. It’s not even that I agree with the 3-dimensional chess argument, but it is a rational argument and Jimmy basically mocks it because he doesn’t agree. Kinda sucks that the passionate but respectful back and forth arguments that I love on the main show won’t make it to AP, I think there are many topics that could result in interesting discussion. Maybe if Malcolm and Steve disagree on something.

  44. I think Malcolm’s argument is correct. Bernie’s ability to expose the differences, the giant rift between him and the DNC, is incredibly important right now. There are two groups on his side: one believes we need to fix the Democratic Party, and the other thinks we need to reject the Democratic Party and start new.

    By engaging in the “Unity Tour,” Bernie is showing that the DNC is NOT willing to come along on the most basic progressive issues such as Single Payer. This is becoming increasingly apparent. Even as conservatives such as Charles Krauthammer admit we are on the road to Single Payer, the Democratic “Leadership” refuses even to discuss it.

    I don’t think Bernie is not doing this out of some cold Machiavellian calculation, however the result of this Tour will be to provide irrefutable and overwhelming evidence that the Democratic Party cannot be saved. I don’t see how Bernie can keep on having interviews like the one with Chris Hayes – or indeed to keep appearing *anywhere* with Tom Perez – and not see that the DNC is beyond saving. The Tour is thus doing immense damage to the credibility of Perez and the Democrats while providing perfect cover and reasoning for Bernie to finally go third party.

    1. I agree with you here. But I don’t see this as some plan by Sanders beforehand. I think thought that it is starting to really dawn on him just how corrupt the Democratic party is, and that there is nothing worth saving in the party. At least that is my hope. There are seems to be increasing indications that he’s finally getting it.

      I doubt there is a “purity” test on the planet that any of these vermin corporate democrats like Perez could pass.

      1. Right you are, and I mistyped my sentence above, I do NOT think this was some Machiavellian move by Bernie. I think he genuinely wants to save the Party – he still thinks it can be brought back to the Party of FDR and not Bill Clinton. Or rather, that is a hopeful wish of his … it will be tough to get him to give up on that, but give up he must.

        1. Yes, this is my thinking as well, and what I perceived was Jimmy’s stance. The argument between him and Malcolm I found rather confusing. I wasn’t exactly sure at times what Malcolm was trying to say – if he was just saying that Bernie really was exposing the obvious phoniness of Perez, which I think we all agree on did happen, or if Bernie was involved in some Machiavellian plot in which it had been his intent from the start to undermine Perez and the Unity Tour.

          I’m just some retired yokel in Idaho, with failing spelling and grammar given my aging brain cells. I spend way too much time on this stuff tbh. But I love the aggressive progressives and Jimmy Dore has been on fire since Trump has been elected. He hasn’t been on the bash Trump 24/7 bandwagon, or promote McCarthyism Russia is evil hysteria – nor has he gone alone with this idea that somehow corporate Democrats will magically come around to becoming progressives by working within the party. I agree with him here. The party is too corrupted for any change now to occur from within.

          Steve and Malcolm also sharp as whip commentators as well. Which makes the show an education.

  45. Yes, the DNC is desperate to corral and control the progressive base through 2017, and Bernie’s sort of going along with it in a way that allows him to maintain his sense of integrity.
    The Dems will make meaningless gestures (like ‘unity’) to get through the next 18 months without a split. In the meantime, millions of progressives are dying to leave the Dems. It appears Bernie can’t or won’t lead to movement in taking the next logical step to start a new party. Too bad, because I believe the corporate DNC is with each passing day buying time, calculating that by 2018, the progressive flame will die out. So, if there’s another progressive leader of stature who wants to start a new party, now is the time to step up.

    1. Thanks for clarifying. Reading your comment, I was thinking, “Who’s this Tom character? Is that who Steve was talking about when he mentioned ‘Everyone else at this table?’ Well… whoever he is, he makes a compelling case!”

  47. i believe that Tom’s agruement is correct. Bernie has been playing this game for 40 years. He knows to choke and cook the “Democrat-goose” by their own words and actions. He is avoiding becoming a partisan target for the Democrats by sitting with them at the table and NOT changing his positions on helath, education etc. it forces the Chris Hayes to then say to the TomPerezes of this world, ” hey you’re full of shit” ; and Bernie doesnt turn into a Susan Sharandon target whilst getting his message out for 2018 and beyond.
    To me he seems to be tilling the soil for resistance so that enough seed grows to make either the Democrats change (which wil never, never happen) or a third party grow.
    Just my opinion.

    I love Jimmy Dore ……….in australia

  48. Clarence Darrow AP T-shirt Jimmy!!!

    Those last two quotes with appropriate profile image puuuhleeeeeeaaaze!

    Guaranteed purchase!

    Thanks gents, really enjoying this show.

    1. I agree with Malcolm and Steve Oh that this ended up being good for Bernie. But I do not believe this was something that Sanders has been planning all along. It just so happens that Perez is more of a douche than one would normally expect in politics.

      I mean, the guy could have just gone alone with Sanders in a better fashion (like most lying democrats are able to do) then stab him in the back later (like most corporate democrats do to progressives). But this guy is so incompetent, he even bungled that.

  50. I believe Bernie is doing what Bernie needs to do for himself, to prove to himself the party of DEMs is just too corrupted, too beholden to the donors, too under the control of the donors, and has too many people at all levels of the party machine wanting their millions for selling out the public to be pushed left with any sincerity. I believe once he does this, which will include the DEMs losing again in ’18, Bernie will accept the request to lead a third party. While I disagree with some of the strategy he deploys, he’s the politician who has successfully run for offices since the early 80’s. I’m just an invisible citizen whose life he’s working to improve.

  51. I cannot say what Bernie is intending, thinking, but certainly, I agree with Malcolm and Steve about how obvious the contrast becomes, as Bernie is Bernie and continues to beat his usual drum, then Tom putters along and sounds ridiculous. In the mean time, more people are hearing Bernie reach out with policy speak, educating them, energizing them….. and come 2018 mid-terms, should be interesting…..

    Hey Malcolm, thanks so much for the Clarence Darrow Happy Birthday, awesome story & quotes–what a mind & spirit! Thanks for the reminder :))

  52. I want to buy a Aggressive Progressives shirt!!! Whoever is in charge of shirts needs to make that happen!

  53. I agree with Malcolm, I used to think like Jimmy about Bernie with the corp dems but Malcolm swayed me. Jimmy’s fear is that the corp dems are using Bernie to distract the voters from what they are doing while getting their votes. The problem is that Bernie has opened the eyes of millions of american’s, I being one of them. I used to never care about politics or the government and now since the primaries I have researched and voted on everything that I had the ability to do so. Along with Bernie, independent media like yourself has also been keeping the public informed. The proof that a lot of people are more informed than every is that unity intro, people cheering and chanting for Bernie to the point the speaker ask them to stop and then had to quickly change subject when the booing started when she said Tom Perez. The average american 4 years ago would never know who the DNC chair is let alone boo them.

    The Flint story makes me think the country I thought we had is gone. I know a lot of people have thought that way already, but for me this was the final nail in the coffin. Police arresting poisoned people for a dress code because of religious reason along with filming a town hall and for asking questions. Trump and the Republicans are not the only problem, we have enemies on all sides. Hopefully the people of this country stand up and fight back.

    1. Perez would never get the crowds he just got on this last tour. They came for Bernie. Bernie is leveraging these corporate democrats and weakening his own position.

      Sanders and progressives would have far more leverage if Sanders formed an Independent party. And he would get bigger crowds.

      This Unity tour along with the Unity commission is a charade.

  54. I agree with Steve oh on the position of Bernie and the dnc. It’s good that he is out with the dnc and showing the better option for the people and using the dnc to do so while making them eat shit when he humiliates them on stage (agreeing with fleshner). But it’s not enough, agreeing with jimmy, in where Bernie is not running the dnc over while driving the bus. He needs to tell people not to vote for democrats unless they kneel to the people. Not accepting corporate money is the absolute minimum and it’s not enough to get them votes. They need to support a green energy program that creates jobs all over the country and forces cities to have large green energy plants, wind farms and solar farms, and then make them a positive in those cities because, I believe its the Netherlands, they have windmills and they are considered a cultural charm of the area. They are a public good that doesn’t pollute the air, water, earth or any of the environment and they rip away power from the dead fuel energy producers that are leading us to extinction for profits. Bernie needs to make the dnc shine a light on the national plumbing crisis, better known as lead crisis, because this is literally everyone’s problems because it’s killing people and the leftist media is burying the story by not focusing on it. He needs to show them brutally tough love and correct their ways. What we are getting is nowhere near a world of enough. Ps. Please do more happy birthday of scientists or people or greatness that did great contributions to society but have been ignored to most of society/history. Alive or dead, they give hope to the people and we need this faint joy in this great time of frustration and sadness.

  55. I agree with Malcolm. Bernie is a master of ‘back-door’ amendments. He’s honestly really savvy…there’s a reason he’s got as much done to this point given the political context during the past 30 years. Right?

    Give him a chance here, Jimmy. I agree with you on most every position, but this one definitely makes a lot more sense through the lens of Malcolm’s. Hasn’t Bernie been fighting the same monster ALL his career? This is his way of literally unveiling the monster behind the mask.

    In the same way, “Hillary is great, compared to Donald Trump.” Hillary looks great because the basis of comparison is so shitty. This is the same thing but on an even greater scale… You can’t hate on “Trump sucks” as much as you can when you can compare it to “Trump sucks and here’s what we need to do: Single-Payer, Free College, End War on Drugs…” etc.

    On television, you’re speaking to the masses and most of those ‘masses’ are over 60 years old (as has been highlighted many times) and they need things laid out VERY clearly.

    All in all, Malcolm’s got this on lock. Jimmy, you need to chill out a bit, but continue to call out Perez’ bullshit. Imagine after this tour, there’s popularity poll on Bernie Sanders and Tom Perez…after that basis of comparison on the national scale becomes obvious…Bernie can break away and form a new party on the ashes of the DNC.

    1. Bernie is not going to be forming a new party any time soon. This is not 3-dimensional chess here. Sanders, clearly believes he can enact change by working with Perez and other corporate Democrats within the party. He’s been saying this now for months – he was even saying it when he campaigned for Hillary Clinton. It’s also the reason why he ran as a Democrat, instead of an Independent. He doesn’t believe working outside the party will be as effective.

      I and other people obviously disagree with him. And there is even been a movement to draft him to start a third party. But so far, he’s continued to attempt to prop up the Democratic party as best he can. It isn’t working clearly – but that’s what he’s been doing.

  56. Bernie needs to have the spotlight on him for his voice to be heard. The more of the limelight he gets the more his policies will stand out from apart of the DNC, just like the cream always rises to the top. That will end of forcing the DNC to become more progressive. And if you don’t think Bernie can do this by going onto this tour, look at Trump who won the GOP primary without the GOP backing…

    1. Baloney. Sanders couldn’t even get Keith Ellison to head the DNC. Hell, he couldn’t get anything he really wanted put into Clinton’s platform.

      You think suddenly they’re going to start listening to him now??

      How naive can you get?

  57. Oh shit. Bernie was not even on the ballot for the actual election. Stupid argument guys. My choice was Hillary, Johnson, Trump. Oh yeah, the green party chick. Stein. If you think we are better off right now with Trump in and Hillary out, then you have screws loose.

    We are witnessing the dismantling of the EPA. Hillary would not have done. We’ll spend billions on a border wall. Hillary would not have done. Cutting incentives for green energy. Hillary would not have done. Yes, I’m pretty sure Hillary would bomb the Middle-east. But we still are. For everyone in Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio and Pennsylvania that declined to vote for Hillary: Thanks for nothing but new misery.

    1. Just another Hillary apologist.

      Let’s not forget folks – that Hillary and her so-called liberal friends, have been calling for more bombs in Syria – and have applauded Trump for his escalation there – and are even now calling him presidential since he’s finally doing what the Neocons and the Neolibs want him to do.

      And let us also remember, that Hillary Clinton has blamed everyone except herself and the phony Democrats who supported her – for Trump’s victory over her lousy campaign. And that she and these phony liberals (such as Rachel Maddow and the rest of the MNBC phonies) have pushed upon us all a new era of McCarthyism upon us – which could well end in a catastrophe of world wide proportions.

      This is what Hillary has wrought and continues to wrought upon us all. Trump won because of Hillary – not because of Bernie, not because of Russia, not because of Sexism. Hillary lost because of Hillary.

      1. Jementa completely misses my point. I don’t know what planet you have to be on to believe that we are better off with TRUMPOTUS rather than HRC.

        I don’t like Hilary. She sucks for corporate money. I voted for Bernie in the Primary. He did not make it. Case closed.

        1. Same old argument from you Compufox.

          It’s the lesser of two evils argument – we heard throughout Hillary’s entire corrupt campaign.

          It’s the same bullshit we’ve been listening to from guys like you for the last 3 decades. That we progressives ask for to much. That we’re too “Pure”> Hell, Hillary Clinton even screamed at the top of her lungs that there will be NO SINGLE PAYER.

          When Obama had both the democratic majority and the house and the Senate, when the Democrats had complete power – what did they do with our Health Care? What did they do Compufox? You know what they did – they gave us a REPUBLICAN health care plan – that was originally written by a Republican think tank org – and they refused to even allow to the table any discussions for Single Payer (hell, Obama had Margaret Flowers arrested outside the White House). Obama, instead of fighting tooth and nail for a more progessives health care plan (that would cover all Americans, not just half the country) – instead, spent his time fighting progressives to accept his fucked up Republican plan and he made absolutely sure the Public Option (which had widespread popularity among all democrats) was never part of his corporate sponsored legislation.

          That’s what the Democrats gave us when they had complete power over both the Executive and Legislative branches of our government. THAT IS THE DEMOCRATS.

          So don’t give me this bullshit about “lesser of two evils”. I’ve heard this same nauseating point from phony libs like you over and over again. Meanwhile, democrats like Obama, like Clinton – like you – voted unanimously along with the Republicans to put Scalia on the bench of SCOTUS. Yeah that’s right – even a few decades ago – the Democrats were absolutely useless to the American people – and went along with Republican legislation. Just as they are now going along with this fucking INSANE Russia hysteria that has put us on the brink of World War III. Just as the democrats are going along with more bombing in Syria. Whatever happened to coming up with other kinds of political solutions – instead of just bombing every fucking chance we get Compufox.

          THAT IS WHAT THE DEMOCRAT PARTY HAS BECOME. A party of war. A party of Wallstreet greed. A party that represents the rich and no longer represents ordinary American people.

          Don’t feed me this bullshit that we would have been better off with the Democratic party. NO my friend, we aren’t. We haven’t been better off with the democratic party now for the last fucking 20 years. And you know why? Because the Democratic party is just as corrupt as the Republican party. In fact, the Democratic party is even worse – because Democrats are willing to lie like shit to their base, and pretend they will pass progressive, liberal legislation (like Obama did) and then once they get into office, they do jack shit for their constituents.

          1. Jamenta, it’s hierarchical, and very simple.

            No one will ever convince me that we are better off without Bernie as president. Love the guy.
            No one will ever convince me that we are better off with Trump, rather than Hillary.

            I am not a Hillary apologist. I wish she would dry up and blow away. It is sickening that she is rearing her hydra head again and that the mainstream media is even bothering to cover it. She needs to go back in the woods and get lost.

            I have been a registered independent for 30 years. I saw a LONG time ago how bereft of principal both major parties are. Whats disturbing is how long its taking the rest of America to wake up. But I am NEVERTRUMP, so Hillary became the default choice, because at least on some issues she would not make things worse. And on most other issues, it can’t get worse. Sad state of affairs, but realistic.

            1. It’s guys like you Compufox that don’t have the guts to get out of an abusive relationship, because it’s better than nothing.

              I’m calling your bullshit along with Bernie Sanders. Grow some balls. Leave the Democratic party and form a new party. Call it the “Progressive Justice Democrats” or “Progressive League” party.

              But just don’t come to me or other real progressives with your trail of tears, saying YOU HAD to vote for the Democrats – YOU HAD TO VOTE FOR CLINTON.

              No you didn’t have to. And if more progressives grew some balls, we wouldn’t be where we are now.

              There is no justification AT ALL for continuing to support the democratic (or republican party). None. Your reasoning is the same kind of reasoning that is being used to resolve SYRIA – that if we just bomb some more (which we’ve been doing now for the last fucking decade almost) – that more bombs will work.

              That if we just keep hanging on to the Democratic party – eventually this abusive spouse of ours, will stop abusing us.

              It’s naive and it hasn’t worked and it won’t work. The lesser of two evils IS STILL EVIL.

              1. Thanks for handling that hillary apologist with 30 year old arguments. I don’t have the energy to directly engage them much anymore, but appreciate when others do.

    3. “The self-lobotomizing of Congress is one of the chief reasons why the executive branch, and behind it the Deep State of contractors, lobbyists and think-tank experts, has filled the void of decision making in Washington.” -Mike Lofgren, The Deep State/The Fall of the Constitution and the rise of a Shadow Government, Penguin Books, 2016.

      First do your homework, then talk about “better off with …”

      Wake up.

    4. > . Yes, I’m pretty sure Hillary would bomb the Middle-east. But we still are.

      This is supposed to be an argument for Hillary? You’re merely underlining why she lost. Pathetic, just like her campaign.

    5. We all get that our political system is completely screwing us, but the answer is not to complain about other American how decided to vote for a slighty shittier candidate. I believe we should be focusing on what we can do to fix it outside the corrupt democratic party. Infighting, between progressives is just what the republicans want; to divide and conquer.

    6. And thanks to you and your ilk for shunning a true progressive in Bernie Sanders and giving us Trump!
      It’s on you blind, policy void, arrogant Hillary supporters that we now have Trump as president.
      Shameful and no right to claim to be progressive Democrats.
      Nice work dummies.

  58. What the hell is Perez is even doing? He gives all Democrats a bad name with his bullshit.

    Wasn’t Keith Ellison supposed to be his deputy? Let him do the talking. Yeeeesh.

  59. I feel like Malcolm and Jimmy were way overcomplicating the Unity Tour. Tom Perez knows that Bernie Sanders is super popular and can drum up support for Democrats. Sanders knows that going out gaining support for progressive policies will drum up grassroots and political activism at all levels. Bernie Sanders has been trying to get his message out for decades now and will do that through whatever means he can.

    That’s their agendas, and I don’t think there’s more to it than that.

    This idea that Tom Perez is being nefarious (rather than just incompetent and corrupt) or that Sanders is trying to undermine the Democrats is ridiculous.

    1. I think there is more to it and I believe Malcolm is closer to the truth than Jimmy. Bernie been in that game for 40 years. He knows how it all works, he’s seen behind the curtain. If you think Bernie don’t have a plan, then you haven’t been paying attention. He and Perez on the same stage highlights the problem with corporate dems. In the end, it is more of an “eye opening” tour than anything else. You really could have laughed at Perez in that interview if it wasn’t downright depressing. The average joe is going to see that contrast and which side do you think they are going to move towards.

      1. Yea, I think that has more to do with Chris Hayes’ questioning and Tom Perez being a terrible spokesman. Certainly Sanders would prefer it if Tom Perez just said that he agreed with him. It’s not like Sanders did anything during the question. He just sat there. And when asked questions he just answers the way he’s always answered.

        I’ve never gotten the impression that Sanders is some sort of Chessmaster. He’s just doing what he’s always done, and Tom Perez apparently really likes punching himself in the face.

        1. Tom Perez is leveraging Sanders’ popularity, and Sanders is leveraging the media coverage of the tour. Ratings are not all that matters, as much as that’s the conventional wisdom, because Sanders has been extremely popular and yet there are many instances of him being muted during the primaries. There is a calculus, and I can see it, that if he acts within the democratic party, he’s not perceived as a threat, and so there’s no danger in letting him say the same stuff he’s been saying for years, but with the bonus of higher ratings. If that’s how he sees things, then it makes more sense to work within the party and get to state his policies every chance he gets to a mainstream audience he otherwise can’t reach rather than work outside and risk being blackballed. This may be his strategy for 2017 and he may change it in future years. And this may in fact be the wrong strategy, but I don’t agree with Jimmy’s unapologetic view of Sanders’ weakness.

  60. The unity tour is absolutly great. Bernie get to put Perez on the spot over and over again and exposes the democratic establishment politicians for the fraud that they are. I’m amaze that all of the progressives commentators are failing to see it. Kyle, that guy from the Humanist Report and even Jimmy…

  61. I agree with Malcolm that Bernie’s presence next to Tom Perez makes it obvious that he is a corporatist tool that doesn’t stand for anything but platitudes and maintaining the status quo. That being said, I have my doubts regarding the critical thinking skills of the current democratic party members who consume cable news as their primary news source, that would enable them to see Perez and the DNC for what they are. I hope I am wrong in that regard, so that Dem party members push the party to actual progressive principals and policies.

  62. Jimmy does not understand that standing next to the guy that only takes his foot out of his mouth to put the other one in means that you look great without having to do anything stupid yourself.

    Bernie may not have designed this trick, but he is definitely smart enough to know a good thing when he sees it and not fuck it up.

    Jimmy, you are screaming at your audience. You have blinded yourself in the name of some purity of your own design. I love your passion, but passion only gets you so far. We need a bit of cold, clean calculation by progressives that are willing to use other means to convince people to actually VOTE for people like Bernie and others like him (Justice Democrats), and not just scream the potential allies out of the room by using a bull-horn in their face.

    Uncle Tom Perez is making a mockery of himself by being on the same stage as Bernie. His ilk of politicians are always slow to respond to movements and cultural changes. Let him keep fucking establishment democrats by highlighting how corrupt they are. That happens faster with Bernie next to him, rather than on established media talk shows without Bernie.

    What else is needed is a “DNC Contribution Website” for the Dem primaries that can be accessed by voters to see how much the establishment Dems take money from the people who would put the Real People down.

    1. Bernie Sanders is towing the current Corporate Democrat line when it comes to the Russia Neo-Mcarthy bullshit, or even the warmongering that is escalating the violence in Syria.

      This is not some nefarious, 3-dimensional chess game Sanders is playing. Sanders has been pushing the “purity test” line along with the rest of the democrats.

      He thinks this is the best way to fix the corruption problem within the Democratic party. That we must continue to compromise with corruption.

      It’s not going to work. Sanders (and the rest of us) will be very very old men and women before Wallstreet and other big donors give up their grip on the Democratic party.

      Unity Tour = progressives need to go along with what the corporate Wallstreet Establishment Democrats want. This is the same for the “Unity Commission”. That’s all it is. There is no equal power here. There will be no honest discussion with equal interests. Big Donor interests are not the same as the interests or values of progressives.

      There can be no compromise with corruption.

      1. I think the expression you want is to “toe the line”:

        Toe the line
        phrase of toe
        1. accept the authority, policies, or principles of a particular group, especially unwillingly.

    2. Leting Tom Perez use Bernie while the media highlights that the dems are corrupt is considered “cold clean calculation”. Seriously?! Bernie eathier HATES the passive position hes in and wants to shift to a more agressive stance, or hes a sad little cuck.

  63. I agree with Steve and Malcolm. I think Bernie is trying to use this Unity tour to pressure Perez and the rest of the DNC towards a more progressive direction. I understand Jimmy’s frustration though. This is similar to the Sanders-Cruz healthcare debate in that a less popular politician, Perez, gets more attention because he’s standing next to Bernie.

    Thanks for a great, thoughtful show, guys! When is TYT going to start selling an AP shirt?

  65. I disagree with Jimmy, but I don’t think Bernie’s “plan” is to make the Democrats look bad. He recognizes that this stupid unity tour is just another way to get out the message. Bernie believes he can do more from within the party. I’m not sure that’s always true though.

  66. Tom Perez is a cuck. He has been cucked by Bernie. DNC is paying for Bernie to go around and showcase the differences. Give Bernie 6 more months of being on the DNC dime, then he’ll spin off. He’ll probably keep the Dem caucus identity, but will campaign for & with Justice Democrat candidates. Jimmy is looking for purity in politics where there just NEVER will be any.

    1. Even if Justice Dems manage to win a few progressive seats in the next election – it’s a fools errand.

      It’s a foolish attempt to put the cart before the horse. The problem with this entire premise is the problem of Wallstreet and big donor money within the democratic party (and which is also now a part of #OurRevolution).

      Wallstreet money still maintains an iron grip on the Democratic party. The DNC is now led by Perez (a corporate cuck obviously) and is stacked with corporate dems who will control whatever comes out of the DNC from here on out. The party is led by Schumer, Pelosi, and other prominent corporate Democrats. And there is no effort AT ALL to change the current make-up of the party, its current big donor influence, or the current system of super-delegate control etc.

      It’s wishful thinking that this will change any time soon. AND IT IS ALSO WISHFUL THINKING that this continuing Wallstreet, Big Donor influence money on the Democratic party will have no impact – on what the party does in 2018, or these people will blithely allow progressives to run when it hits their bottom line: what the Big Donors of the party want.

      This “Unity Commission” and “Unity Tour” what is it? Why is there a need for “UNITY” in the first place? What exactly are we suppose to to UNIFY for?

      I’ll tell you what this Unity Tour and Unity Commission is. It’s the same as the “purity” test meme that the Clinton Dems have been gas lighting progressives with lately. It’s EXACTLY the same. It’s the same thing an abuser tells their abused spouse: that you can’t leave the relationship, that you want too much, that you think the world is perfect, and it isn’t. SO- they must stay within the abusive relationship. They must be UNIFIED
      with the party.

      It’s the love it or leave it bullshit. Meanwhile, this corrupt party continues to keep all the levers of power. And it’s not going to change. AND A FEW PROGRESSIVES INSIDE THE PARTY ARE NOT GOING TO CHANGE IT.

      It’s time to form a new party and get the hell out of this abusive relationship. The Democrat party is corrupt. Time to leave.

      1. I agree.

        If you are interested in the details about “Washington”, here’s a good read:

        Mike Lofgren, The Deep State/The Fall of the Constitution and the rise of a Shadow Government, Penguin Books, 2016: “The self-lobotomizing of Congress is one of the chief reasons why the executive branch, and behind it the Deep State of contractors, lobbyists and think-tank experts, has filled the void of decision making in Washington.”

  67. I think what is easily overlooked in this argument is what happens behind closed doors.

    We know now that Bernie was threatened to have his leadership position taken away if he campaigned in Florida for Tim Canova’s run against DWS. That leadership position (though devoid of large decision making power) is valuable.

    In the same vein as that, Bernie is weighing the good vs the bad here.

    I don’t know if him gaining influence within the Democratic Party is strategically better than him flat out opposing Democrats, but I do know that the 2 party system creates a system of gatekeepers that is tough to overwhelm.

    We are threading a very delicate needle here.

  68. Love aggressive progressive. We must purge the democaratic party of corporate money, of corporate democrats. The progressives need to keep bringing up the most popular, famous democrat of all; Franklin Roosevelt. why do we let Republicans keep invoking Lincoln from 150 years ago
    “The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.”FDR

  69. UNITY TOUR. That’s the name of the tour Bernie Sanders is on.

    “UNITY”

    Why is there even a tour called “UNITY” in the first place? Why is there any question STILL within the democratic party about what is needed in this country? Why the charade?

    Why not call it: the People’s TOUR – and focus on actual ISSUES: get rid of big money and big donors in politics? There should be no continuing equivocation regarding Wallstreet influence on the Democratic party, or Big Money donors influencing the party -regarding Single Payer. There should be no BULLSHIT about minimum wage.

    BUT we’re not getting this on this tour from Perez or any of the other Clintonite phony progressives – or from the #OurRevolution democrats who now are beginning to gas light progressives who are not willing to go along with this latest bullshit from the party. And yet #OurRevolution is all to ready to accept billionaire money to run its campaign. I mean WTF?

    I’m with Jimmy on this. This isn’t some kind of 3 dimensional chess Sanders is playing. Sander’s (as he has been doing for some time) is just going along with the same crap the Clintonite democrats have been pushing even before Trump was elected. IT’S THE SAME SHIT. The whole focus is – you must COMPROMISE – you must UNIFY. That’s the name of the tour folks. UNITY. Are we suppose to continue to go along with this nonsense? To continue to remain the abused wives to an abusive, obviously corrupt democratic party?

    Wake the fuck up.

    IT’S NOT OK. THEY’VE SOLD OUT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE AND THEY’VE SOLD OUT PROGRESSIVES. AND THEY’RE NOT GOING TO STOP.

    Bernie Sanders will be a very very old man before these fucks give him any real power. This whole tour is a charade along with this UNITY COMMISSION. Ask yourself, who maintains the REAL power on this “Unity Commission”? It ain’t actual progressives. It’s fucking Perez and the rest of the lobbyist/Clinton goons that will override anything the Sander’s progressives might attempt to do. They’ll do the same fucking thing they did with the Democratic platform. Why are progressives continuing to be so naive about this? WHY?

    You’re NOT going to change the democratic party from the inside. Stop with the nonsense.

    And please, spare me the bullshit that Sanders wouldn’t be able to go around the country on his own and not be heard. In fact, if Sanders left the Democratic party – he would reach MORE Americans not less. He still is the most popular politician – probably on the entire fucking planet right now. Don’t feed us this bullshit that people will stop showing up once he leaves the democratic party. NONSENSE

  71. Jimmy is right! Bernie shouldn’t b condoning the dnc’s actions. What is he gaining from looking embarrassing next 2 Tom Perez and not even saying Perez is wrong but just sitting there. By him sitting there not challenging Perez looks like he agrees with him. The end game is 2 add more people 2 the party but the party is corrupt so even with bernie sitting there it’s not going 2 change a damn thing but bernie looking ridiculous.

    1. I think Bernie has very good political instincts and it may not be appreciated at first glance. Tom Perez knows he has basically nothing to say and is the worst apologist imaginable..Jimmy dissection of Tom P is almost an art form.

  72. If Bernie was this popular 10 yrs ago, he probably would have created a 3rd party but I guess at his age, he knows that he will retire in 6-8 yrs and won’t be in Washington for long, so he is trying to push the Democratic Party to the left and get progressive democrats like Thompson and Quist elected to make the Dems a centre-left party rather than centrist party.

    I love Jimmy’s passion but he needs to understand that Bernie will never accept Nick Brana’s offer. You gotta accept Bernie for who he is and appreciate whatever he is trying to do even if you disagree with his strategy. If you don’t like it, then go build up the Green Party. Nothing wrong with that, we are all progressives here. But at the end of the day, Bernie’s rallies are getting more people involved and nothing Green Party does will match the impact Bernie has.

    Bernie is never gonna be the next Ralph Nader. It’s disappointing but it is what it is. Alienating Bernie serves nobody.

    1. I forgot to mention that even though corporate Dems don’t like Bernie or his platform, Bernie has 80% approval amongst democrats. If he leaves to make a third party, will that 80 % of the Dems follow him? I don’t think so. I think Bernie feels the same way as well.

    2. Democrats in their current form are dead. Progressives will never support it. didn’t work when Bernie stumped for Hillary and won’t work now, Good luck with that.

  73. “The self-lobotomizing of Congress is one of the chief reasons why the executive branch, and behind it the Deep State of contractors, lobbyists and think-tank experts, has filled the void of decision making in Washington.” -Mike Lofgren, The Deep State/The Fall of the Constitution and the rise of a Shadow Government, Penguin Books, 2016.

    A MUST READ FOR ALL PROGRESSIVES!!!

  74. I think Jimmy is right. Bernie should be directly calling the corporate Democrats out, not propping them up and calling for “unity” under their corporatist leadership. I hope Bernie’s plan works, but I won’t just blindly trust that it is the best plan.

  75. I believe Bernie’s words are devastating to the case of the Democratic party. He has a message and plan and they don’t. End of story.

    While I see Jimmy’s point about Bernie needing to start a new party, I think we have to “seed” the policies of progressivism in the public’s mind. If Bernie just keeps getting a platform, it gets spread. Call me an optimist, but that’s my own programming.

    However, the big question is… can people see the difference between a person with actual policies and a person with platitudes?

    It may be that I have more faith in the kids that are growing up in this interconnected social media world. The kids that are 15 now are going to be voting in 2020. We need to win them over and then get them to vote. I want to believe that’s the sleeping giant we’re trying to awaken.

    1. Bernie is very cautious and plays holding his cards close to his vest. His popularity is something the Dem Elitist are more than a bit chagrined about. Tom P is the cellophane man you can see right through. He can barely cast a shadow.

  76. I agree with Jimmy that the best strategy to get Bernie Sanders’ Platform implemented is for him to start his own party and to verbally call out the democrats as part of the problem just like Kshama Sawant does in Seattle. I think Bernie Sanders just like in the primary does not want to be the “Ralph Nader” and is trying to have trail of evidence of him trying to push the party in the right direction just in case he does start a new party/abandon the Dems. I also think that the more Bernie Sanders is pushing his ideas across America the better even if it is with Tom Perez and the DNC because it is obvious who has the correct message and who does not. My preference would be for Bernie to stop playing nice though because they didn’t with him in the primary and probably wont with the rest of progressives either. It would energize progressives and completely pull off the mask of these corporate dems.

  77. Great show as always. Please stop editing out portions of the shows. As a member it makes no sense that I miss content because I didn’t watch it live.

  78. Malcolm is absolutely right. Bernie is appealing to the new people. And ensuring they know the other people who are willing to fight the establishment in the crowd. Watching Perez get rekt every time he’s out there with Bernie is a Pro-Bernie strategy.

    1. Tom Perez has never run for office, of any kind. Then he sits next to a man who has won more races than just about anyone in Washington DC.. The difference is more than just a bit stark!

  79. Jimmy – you keep saying that you’re just a jagoff comedian, but you’re able to see through the shit-sandwich that the DNC is trying to sell. I think the rest of the progressive community is able to see it too. Just the contrast between how the crowd responds to Bernie vs. how the crowd responded to Perez; they ain’t buying what he’s selling.

    I’m completely with Malcolm and Steve on this. No one in the progressive community is falling for the pretty little lies of the DNC. But, to be fair, then what about the rest? For people who already support the dem establishment, this will just be evidence for what they already believe (wrongly) to be true: see! Perez is just like Bernie! They’re on the same platform! Bernie supports Perez!

    That leaves the independents. What we saw in the primary is that more independents supported Bernie, and all Bernie really had going for him was his policy. That suggests that independents, generally, pay attention to policy positions, and it is rather likely that they would see exactly what all of you saw: look at the sharp contrast between Bernie and Perez!

    There’s an element of this that is yet to be seen, namely what happens in two years. We’ve already seen Bernie campaign for people who the DNC didn’t support (most recently in Nebraska). We’ll have to see what Bernie’s messaging will be during the next election cycle. Will he join the DNC with their endorsements, or will he endorse candidates that he believes in, *even if* they are running against the DNC’s preferred candidate? I think we know what he’ll do.

    1. I agree.

      If voters remember what Bernie’s saying now when it’s 2020, and I think people will, when the Democrats DON’T do the things Bernie’s saying and has been saying, it’s going to be very easy for him to say “I did all I could to affect change in the DNC, you can see what they are selling… nothing for the American worker / citizen.”

      I’m an optimist, but your post is on point!

      PS Remember, voters in 2020 are 15-17 years old at the moment. We’re talking to a new generation that are totally plugged in. If Trump continues his devastation, the rebellion will continue to grow.

  80. When Bernie appears with Tom Perez, he gets to address people he would never reach on his own. And the audience gets to compare two different visions for the future of the American Left.

    On his own, Bernie would be preaching to his choir. This tour gives him the opportunity to reach beyond his base, to potential converts.

    Bernie is making his case to the Democratic Party. We saw how well that worked last year. Have faith that others will see what we’ve know all along.

    1. Totally agree with you. That was the first thing that came to mind as I watched the glaringly obvious difference between the two. I don’t think it was lost on a majority of the viewers of this appearance and will only help the true progressive agenda as the “Unity Tour” rolls on.

      1. Thanks.

        Keep in mind that Perez has the same opportunity to appeal to Bernie fans, but lacks Bernie’s ability to capitalize on it.

  81. He’s knuckling under to stay relevant. Maybe for some heroic moment later; a jump to a third party, I don’t know. It all comes down to what you stand for. I feel like he’s had to fight for the platform and relative freedom he currently has, and what he’s doing now is what he feels is the best way to continue to keep spreading his message to the masses.

  82. It doesn’t seem like Bernie is purposely setting up a juxtaposition. It seems like he’s trying to help the image of the DNC and the Dems. I don’t think Bernie should go around with Tom Perez who is very establishment.

  83. I’m with Malcolm and Steve. Bernie believes that we have to organize and resist. The speeches he’s giving now in this sickening unity tour are the same as his campaign speeches — think BIG not small, he tells them; also, he tells them that if they think they’re not smart enough to run for office, they should see who he has to deal with in the senate. He is responsible for inspiring all the resistance in this country. He’s still telling people that he’s not a democrat. I’ve watched every speech he’s given, both during the campaign and on this so-called unity tour and people respond to him with the same energy. This would not happen if he’d sold out or was deluded. They know him. Also, this show is very important to me. I look forward to it all week. It’s the reason I’m a member.

  84. Mmmm. I am in Jimmy’s camp and disagree with Malcolm. I’ve always had the impression that Bernie is honest and transparent and would never stoop to having hidden, ulterior motives. He is also too kind and hopeful. By now one would think that he would realize that a quest to “reform” the Democrats is futile. They will never give up their corporate money. Never. Ain’t gonna happen. In fact, I have asked Bernie, but have never received an answer: WHO is funding this 9-state trip? The DNC? With funds from its corporate donors? Gawd, I hope not, for I didn’t think I’d ever see the day when Bernie would take such money.

  85. I love the show and love Jimmy’s passion, but I think that his hatred/distrust of the DNC (which I share, don’t get me wrong) is blinding him to some of the nuance of the Unity tour. Jimmy is a little caught up in the intentions of the DNC and not with how things are actually playing out.

    The DNC definitely intends this to be a “Bernie Band-aid tour” where they let Bernie talk and say what people want to hear, but the party makes no serious change. I don’t think that is controversial to say.

    My problems are that Jimmy is talking about Bernie like h is some kind of sucker. Give the man some credit. I can totally see it playing out like the DNC approached him about doing this tour, he said to himself “you mean I can go say my message about a new green deal etc. next to Perez? Sign me up!” Knowing that when people see the two of them next to each other Perez will come out looking like a bullshit artist.

    My other problem is I don’t think Jimmy is giving voters enough credit. Between the clip with the two of them on Chris Hayes where Perez looks like a straight up clown and the clips of people booing Perez and enthusiastically cheering Bernie I’d say voters are sending a pretty clear message about who they side with.

    Again, I get it. I see most things the DNC does as potentially nefarious and I don’t doubt that they had bad intentions with the whole Unity Tour, BUT I don’t think that you can assume everyone on the tour (Bernie) has those intentions, and if Bernie can use the tour to show that his message is the right message he has accomplished something. Jimmy is probably right that the DNC will try to ignore it, but lines going out the door when it isn’t even campaign season for a senator from Vermont is a pretty clear message.

    Great show this week, very happy Malcolm was on this week to even out the discussion. Keep up the good work Ag-Pros!

  86. I’m with Michael and Steve. Just the act of Bernie being adjacent to democrats pulls them more left OR they try to deflect and look like fools.

  87. I think Bernie found a way to continue to promote his agenda while highlighting that the democratic establishment does not support progressive policies.

  88. And Bernie is playing the smooth political game and sorry JD, I’m with Malcolm on this one although I identify 100% with your frustration….I too would love to see Bernie stick it to these corporate sellout tools.

  89. Firstly, I LOVE this show. Fantastic conversions & varying viewpoints with real passion makes me feel like someone else understands how many of us think on the issues facing our country and the world.
    Second, I agree with Malcolm in that senator Sanders is essentially mushing his agenda in the democrats face publicly so they have to respond unprepared the way Ton Perez had to. Also, seeing the way voters respond to the senator vs. Tom Perez is being viewed by others not not going along to get along.
    I do however believe the elites in the D.C. establishment look at that and see what Jimmy sees, which is co-opting senator Sanders message as a guise so they don’t have to change. I think they we’ll try to use this unity tour later to handcuff senator Sanders to them, but he’s keeping his distance right now to a degree.

  90. Thanks Gents!

    Loving the aggressiveness of you progressive impressives!!!

    Just one thing….80 minutes AIN’T an hour and a half!

    I want as much AP as I can get.

  91. My favorite show each week. Thanks for extending the length! I have to disagree with Jimmy. Bernie being given a platform from the DNC and spreading his message, not their message. They may gain some elections from his presence, but many long time democrats have not realized what has become of their party, and he is educating them. I will continue to support him as long as he stays true to his message.
    Blessings to the oppressed.

  94. Nina Turner advised progressives last year to give the Dem Party takeover two years and then if we have not succeeded changing the ship’s course, we still have time to get our third-party act together in time to run a great candidate in 2020.

    I think that’s sound advice for two reasons — one, the Giant Ship Democrat is a prize worth taking, a huge gleaming superstructure with a still-significant older voter base who will loyally check the box next to “D” and give the “D” candidate that advantage on any ballot.

    But second and actually more important to me — the networking and education opportunities are amazing. Two years ago, I did not know what an ADEM was, nor had I ever given any thought to joining our county’s Democratic Central Committee. Now I’m an executive officer on our DCC and a voting Delegate to the CA State Democratic Party Convention in May. I belong to a number of party caucuses (Thomas Frank will be the speaker at the Progressive Caucus in May) and my own personal email database of REAL PROGRESSIVES has multiplied exponentially.

    I am forming alliances that will last a life time. I am learning who to trust and who not to trust. I am learning strategy and getting perspectives I was never expose to before. All of this is “courtesy” of the political machine which all of us Progressives are willing to abandon without a second thought or a single look back, if we fail in our mission to alter the ship’s corporatist-course.

    But if and when the day comes that we need to abandon this ship, we will no longer be a rag-tag mish-mash of random lefties without unity, strategy or a comprehensive game plan.

    No, thanks to the political machine which we are, right now, infiltrating, we will be much stronger and better able to fight that machine from the outside, if that’s what needs to be done.

    Right now, we are fighting it from within, trying to change it. If necessary, we will leave and fight it from the outside — and, thanks to the learning and networking we are doing right now… We will win.

  95. It looks like Jimmy is being blinded by his passion. It’s the same problem Debra Messing has, but she’s on the other side. I’m with Steve and Malcolm on this and I’ve been running into more and more people who are unwilling to listen to other people who see things differently, but ultimately agree on the big picture. Frankly, I think it’s really damaging. It’s like people in our camp are resorting to self-harm. Don’t be a cutter.

    If I were to talk to all the voters on my block, I can almost guarantee that none of them know who Tom Perez is or anything about him. Bernie can’t just flip on the DNC without people understanding the issue. The issues are being put on the table. Practice a little patience. We have to work together and we don’t have to start lashing at each other.

    1. I agree completely. I’ve had to block some progressives on facebook because they attack anyone who doesn’t disavow Bernie Sanders. If you don’t see things their way, you are the enemy or a DNC shill or some such nonsense. When I asked what their plan was all I got was more insults laced among comments about their own political superiority. I don’t see that as a winning strategy. The wisdom and patience of a man like Bernie seems lost on them even though they generally agree with his policy positions.

  96. Using contrast is the best way to highlight something. Bernie sitting next to a Democrat shows how shitty these Democrats are. Bernie gets more invites to talk because he’s on the unity tour. His message gets out and immediately can be compared to the nonmessage from the Democratic stooge sitting next to him. At the same time Bernie is backing actual progressives running in different states. He’s working not to rebuild but to replace the stooges in the current Democratic party. Isn’t that what Cenk is doing with the justice Democrats?

    1. That makes absolutely no sence to me. Realy think about it. How can anyone take over a party that has complete control over how the rules are interpreted. If you ever learned about how comitties work you will know that this is very difficult even with popular support. Bearnie is already the most popular politician, so if has any backbone at all, then he should not associate himself with slimy leaches like tom perez, and hillary clinton. Bearnie doesnt need the Democrats, so fuck them. He can win with independents and progressives alone.

      1. You don’t seem to understand that “winning” means very little if you cannot work with the other people in Washington to get things done. Who do you think Bernie should caucus with if not the Democrats? Should he forgo all committee positions so as not to “associate himself with slimy leaches”. Bernie has plenty of backbone. He also possesses patience, experience, and the wisdom to know that hating on those with whom he disagrees accomplishes nothing in terms of passing legislation and protecting our social safety net.

        You take over a party by replacing its members. That is something we can do.

        1. I respect your opininion. I guess only time will tell if weather Bernie is wasting his time trying to change the DNC, or if he is better of giving the deep six to it and rebuilding from scratch. Major shift in our political system have happened before in the civil war. I think this maybe a new one unfolding.

    2. It is Bernie who democratic candidates will be seeking his blessing if the cheers from the crowds are any indication. With any luck the DNC will fall right in his lap saying they were with him all along. What.

  97. Great conversation…Bernie came to my town last week and I wanted to go but I didn’t because of Tom Perez. I felt the same way Jimmy was. They are just dicking us around and I’m tired of the DNC.

  99. Im not done talking yet. Bring back the heavy hitters! Real aggressive progressives from the civil rights era like Dr. Martin luther King who faught tooth and nail against the American terrorist organization known as the KKK, and the military Indurial complex with far less support than we see today. Real aggressive progressives like president FDR who purged the corrupt federal reserve influence over the economy, and in return gave us the largest job creating, “shovel ready” infrastructure plan that the world has ever seen. Real aggressive progressives like lydon B Johnson who jumpstarted the most aggressive war on poverty this country has ever seen. We have grown very lazy and complacent with crapulent polititians that makes Bearnie Sanders and Elizabeth seem like gods gift to earth, so its easy to forget how only 60 years ago every day Americans enjoyed the highest standered of living known as the era of American exceptualism. Today, with about half of our population in poverty, thanks to the 40 yr decline of liberalism, its hard to differentiate us from a 3rd world country. I wonder why Trumps “Make America Great Again” slogan is so effective in catching the attention of the poor white working class who have been abandoned by the democratic party.

  100. but how many people won’t be able to tell the difference and will think both sanders and perez are on the same side. we’ll find out soon enough .

    1. that woman from Flint is way smarter than me and she fell for it and voted for Hillary.
      she was gaslights by the DNC into believing Trump was the apocalypse! the end of the world!
      If sanders is doing this on purpose it’s a very dangerous strategy.

      1. Clinton would have been the same old corruption to which we are accustomed. Trump is taking the corruption to new lows and is basically a disaster on every measure of the job. Thinking Trump is the apocalypse and wanting to defeat him is hardly a ringing endorsement of Clinton.

        1. Yea, I voted for her or to be more exact, I voted against the empty suite with the big expense account on the US credit card. I had no hopes of HRC doing much good for the country as a whole but I hoped, maybe wrongly, that at least she might maintain the status quo which now looks pretty good.

  101. This id the first time I have not agreed with Jimmy %100. I’m confident that enough Americans are smart enough to see the difference between Perez and Sanders. Malcolm is right in that Bernie is highlighting the problems with the DNC whether or not that is what he intended with this ‘unity’ tour.

  103. Am I the only one who strongly agrees with Jimmy?! The shows called AGRESSIVE PROGRESSIVES not passive aggressive; this is the same crap that got trump elected. Bernie needs to take a more direct approach combating the DNC. Its painfully fusturating watching him convince milenials that theirs still hope left for Democratic Party that very clearly shows no sign of changing. Wake up! The establishment has no respect us, and only intends to use Sanders to prevent a complete and absolute collaps of a dying party.

  104. Both viewpoints have some validity. Bernie seems to have a plan but that plan is undeniably fraught with some danger for the Berniecrats and the movement. There are major potential pitfalls here and one must never underestimate the power of the establishment to bend even this to its ultimate advantage. Secondly, not all of Bernie’s plans are equally well-thought out. Jimmy is just hedging his bets and that is a necessary dose of caution which must never be absent from such discussions.

  105. The big question is WHAT were Tom Perez and Bernie doing up on Chris Hayes or any mass media platform TOGETHER? WHO decided this?

    Remember the DCCC (Democratic Corporate Cash Collectors) or the DNC (Democrats-N-Corporatists) decided to give Bernie that ‘position’ as ‘Outreach Blah Blah Blah’ like they gave Keith Ellison that ‘Deputy Chair’ thingy, which means NADA. These Dems are sooooo Tammany Hall still, they’re like greedy record companies buying then shelving good artists because they won’t ‘behave.’ Like Nomiki said, the only positions that mean anything at the DNC are the Chair and the Treasurer. All the other ‘positions’ are like Jimmy says ‘BRRRRTT.’

    So what happened then, Tom ordered Bernie to show up with him, but Bernie said something like ‘Okay with that political rank pull Tom, but in exchange I keep my own platform and get to say whatever I think needs to be said.’ Did this happen? Because we all saw Tom shimmying and shaking up in there, trying to spin it. If this is how it happened that’s the DNC’s dumbest move yet, letting Chris shoot the sheriff like that.

    Can’t shoot the ‘deputy’ if he ain’t there, huh.

  106. Hillary’crats, or anyone who’d respond to the DNC’s failed campaign with platitudes, is not looking for solutions. Sad to say, but Bernie’s suffering of the dncc is not a good sign overall. He’s like a super progressive trapped in a necons pocket; a parlor trick for the base.

  107. Yes!!! A whole hour and half. Thanks TYT. Aggressive Progressives is my favourite show.

    I’m not totally sure whether or not Bernie is playing chess or not. I think it will be revealed in the coming days of the unity tour on what this is truly about. If Bernie sticks to his progressive talking points and doesn’t start talking platitudes during the tour, then I think Malcolm is correct. I watched that interview and it really looked like Bernie was hitting hard with his points. He wasn’t being soft and weak, rather spoke with passion and conviction.

    I think Bernie is actually educating the democratic party during this tour more than educating the voters. I believe that Bernie trusts the voters more than he trusts the democratic part as they have to live with the mess politicians have created.

    As long as he sticks to his guns….which he always has.

  108. Throwing away a child’s meal in front of their faces because their parents can’t afford to pay for it…that is absolutely rage-inducing, but also, simultaneously, it is a natural expression of the violence of capitalism, which is all around us. Neoliberal capitalism inflicts these acts of aggression on us on a daily basis, of which the passenger being thrown off the commercial flight was another perfectly apt, meaningful illustration.

  109. Malcom and Steve are right.

    Jimmy don’t freak out! Bernie knows best bro. He is the Jedi, we are but padawans.

    Obama played 3D chess. Bernie is playing interdimensional Mortal Kombat for the soul of the DNC

  110. Bernie is playing Tom to the public like a fiddle. Chris Hayes didn’t excellent job of juxtaposing the twos stance on where the DNC Is standing! It is standing still in the standing of the same bullshit and always has! Tom Perez showed exactly what the party line is keep it closed and keep the money rolling in .

    Bernie on the other hand stated exactly what he has an independent stands for he is stating he is an independent he is stating that everyone should be inclusive he is stating Medicare for all education free to public universities He is stating his platform. Remember this is only going to be a four or five state tour in important states states that Bernie Sanders will stand even taller in and where Tom Perez and HRC will remain smaller and smaller. When this tour is over I do believe Bernie Sanders will break away remaining independent and he will either run himself Or he will back Tulsa Gabbard. She has ethics she has guts and she has stood up in Congress and taking the heat and the knives gracefully and not back down an inch.

    Remember she quit the DNC after their bullshit and she joined Bernie Sanders because of their bullshit she is a veteran she wants us out of these bullshit wars and she is strong enough with his blessings and backing to make it through !

  111. The saddest thing about America is that Obama probably is our “best” president… #notsayingmuch

  113. Bernie is playing chess. He knows long game. It’s our message. We are coming. We are too strong Jimmy, don’t freak out.

  115. Look forward to this show like I did on the radio once a week for Joe Frank. Right up my alley!

  117. 100% agree with Malcom Fleshlight… Jimmy would be correct if Bernie was simply parroting and toeing the dnc line. However, its clearly obvious that he is not doing that by promoting single payer and attacking corporate donars, both of which are not backed by the dnc.

    I love you Jimmy but you have got to take another OBJECTIVE look at this…

    1. I agree with Malcom only. Bernie is playing Chess not checkers. He’s always been doing that. Some times he looses the game but I feel he at least has a game plan.

  118. regarding the issue of WTF is Bernie doing on this tour. I have been very torn about this however, after i saw the Chris Hayes Interview it clicked and yes I think Malcolm is right. Bernie is using this tour to point out how fucking corrupt and bought the DNC and Tom are. The tour will either push Tom to say more and more progressive things (which he will later retract) or Tom will stay the course and serve platitudes. Its a win win for Bernie. If this is not the strategy we are really fucked. However, Malcolm is right Bernie is politician so he knows how to play this game better than us. I trust his judgement. If it were not for him we wouldn’t be even having this conversation. So who am I to judge.

  120. Great opening. Mfers suck, (good job Jimmy). Proud of you all. Laid bare. Zeitgeist, Steve is right as many know.

  121. I think both of you are right, whether or not Bernie intends to do this, it’s having the effect of humiliating the corporate dems. Also Bernie’s strategy might be to sort of twist their hand via the comparison.

      1. Thanks! I actually found out after I’d posted. I live in Austin and I’m planning a long drive so I can be there in person. The idea is to try to make it part of a cross country family vacation. Just gotta nail down the rest of the planning. I WANT TO SEE JIMMY (and everyone ) LIVE! :)

  124. Also the reason I signed up for TYT, love you guys!
    Hopefully you guys can get some big progressive names like Cornell West or Nina Turner sometime soon :)!

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