The fourth installment of Aggressive Progressives with Jimmy Dore and Steve Oh. Hear Jimmy and Steve rant and rage about a HRC presidency and Colin Powell’s email leak. Jimmy also shares that he has signed Cenk up for a Scientology course.
I’m super late to post; but I loved Steve’s good cop bad cop analogy. It’s perfect for the place we find ourselves after decades of democrats campaigning and governing on the defense with “compromise” after “compromise”.
Is this going to be the norm? We have to hope and pray for the next video to come out on demand? I love AP and TYT but this is discouraging. I need my fix of Jimmy Dore! :)
In the meantime, you could watch some of the Jimmy Dore Show. One recent segment that is especially good is called “Sander’s Supporter Tells Hillary How To Get Her Vote – in 6 Easy Steps”. It’s beautiful. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuczmdowehU
Steve needs his pic on the banner too! Love the show.
Trump gets elected you will finally see total establishment bipartisan action, they’ll impeach him rapidly, Pence is who is the actual danger.
Another great show, really loving this new member feature. Although would reaally enjoy a more frequent show, like atleast twice a week!
Also, gotta agree on Michael.. Like he seems like a great guy, and I love when he’s on Old School and stuff. But over the years he has grown more and more establishment. Such a shame. Anyway hey, it is nice to get more viewpoints! Great show, though–pumped for the next one tomorrow!
I can’t wait til Trump is president and Jimmy goes to his republican friends to help “fight” him only to find them spitting in his face right behind their dear leader. You have literally no reason to think any of this will happen but just need to justify the continued argument likening Hillary to Trump. This stupid fantasy is getting irritating and if you’re going to continue to use the excuse of being comedian to not understand reality then please only wear a clown costume going forward. I don’t say this because I worry about Hillary but because you’re now a liberal version of fact free, emotion filled fox news. Jimmy needs to fix his brain on this because I always thought he was great forever up until the primary ended but it appears something triggered a major lapse of reason he cannot overcome. You’re definitely smarter than this
Maybe it would be that if I only wrote that one sentence. I’m obviously being facetious and mocking his absurd theory. What’s lazy and unintelligent is speculating that there will be a kumbaya moment with liberals and conservatives against Trump and forget the supreme court and any and all environmental regulations, food regulations, etc. I think others should actually take a break and some deep breathes because these guys are not using their brains in considering what the GOP will be able to pass with control of house, senate and presidency. Jimmy especially took the primary race waaay too personal and now just want to stick it to the dems. If Bernie never ran against Hillary we would not even be having these conversations at all.
> Jimmy especially took the primary race waaay too personal and now just want to stick it to the dems.
You think this is about vengeance and petty things like that? (It’s telling that your understanding of politics apparently operates as this base level where it’s all about vendettas, tribes, personalities, factionalism, and hurt pride) By definition, if you’re an “aggressive progressive” then you care more about progressivism than about any such pettiness.
What a progressive should take seriously is the long Democratic drift towards the Right, which started sometime in the late 80’s, which was accelerated by the Clintons in the 90’s, and which has basically robbed us of a leftwing party that isn’t corporatist, corrupt and beholden to the business class. That was already my analysis 15 years ago and everything that has happened since then has only confirmed it, making abundantly clear what should be done: stop supporting these rightwing Democrats who keep traveling towards the Right and becoming more corrupt along with the system itself. For me, Clinton has already been the ultimate symbol of what’s gone wrong in the political system for a very long time, and everything that happened during the primaries merely confirmed my analysis once again, and re-emphasized the conclusion: such Democrats are a side of politics to be fought and defeated, tooth and nail.
“By definition, if you’re an “aggressive progressive” then you care more about progressivism than about any such pettiness.” – Now you’re just making things up and if you can’t see the bitterness then you’re blind.
I don’t disagree with your position about the dems. They absolutely have their flaws and I voted for Sanders because of that. My critique is about Jimmy’s theory which essentially advocates for Trump over Clinton. He can say all day that it doesn’t but that is the logical conclusion to what he is saying. Watch him again if you don’t think so. It is an idiotic theory with no facts or history to back it up and when he is challenged on it he simply diverts attention to Clinton’s negatives while ignoring the insanity that will ensue with Trump and GOP controlled house and senate. That is not theory. That will literally happen and the idea that the GOP will “fracture” and won’t pass much of Paul Ryan and Trump’s agendas is nonsense. They will push this country further right than Clinton ever will and voting for someone I dislike to stop that is not my favorite option but the only actual one.
It’s also worth remembering that Jimmy did much to make us aware of just how frightening Trump, and especially his “deplorable” followers were when he covered the Trump rallies. More than any other “reporter” covering a Trump rally, he exposed how terrifying these supporters were and the extent to which MSM reporters were failing in their responsibilities when covering Trump. It’s somewhat disingenuous now to argue that Trump and his supporters aren’t actually the crazy, bigoted, hate-filled maniacs that he once convinced us they were. Were you right then Jimmy, or are you right now?
It’s not possible to find your critique when it’s wrapped up in a bunch of stuff that is centered purely on Jimmy’s person – “he’s stupid, he’s friends with Republicans, he’s bitter, he’s irrational”, etc. That’s what I mean by petty.
I might be in the habit of calling Ben and Michael “establishment” – which, anyway, they themselves would not go out of their way to deny – but I would never say that this has anything to do with a character flaw or personal deficiency on their part. They are just on that side of the equation, like some people are, for bigger reasons. Jimmy is definitely on a different side of the equation, and so am I.
Clinton is the core, the dark heart, of what’s wrong with the system. Trump is not. Trump is a superface symptom; a serious symptom but a symptom nonetheless. Nor is it surprising to see it emerge – in fact, it makes perfect logical sense. Am I going to let a symptom distract me from the disease? No, not in a million years.
Obviously I meant to write “Trump is a surface symptom”. Funnily enough, from its Latin etymological roots, “superface” has the same semantic meaning as “surface” even though it is a typo.
You’re just misreading my comment. I called HIS THEORY stupid. I am making fun of his idea of coming together with republicans against Trump, not dissing him having republican friends. I have republican friends. They all love Trump. I still even like Jimmy because I can separate those things. I’ve seen him argue this point so many times and he always ends up circling the wagons when faced with real push back on the basis of it being a choice between Trump and Clinton. He won’t admit that and if you can’t see how disingenuous it is then you’re falling for confirmation bias because it’s obvious. And if someone gets him in a corner he’ll fall back to the “just a comedian” defense but he actually has a pretty damn large platform as a political pundit, call it what you will. That is all and if you want to defend his theory go ahead but really not looking to debate Trump vs Clinton.
Fair enough, but you still use a great deal of personalized language. When people critique a theory, usually the language involved is more about the theory and less about the person.
It is flat out wrong to say Jimmy supports Trump over Clinton. He supports Stein over Clinton and isn’t willing to compromise his principles over hyped up fear over Trump. He said so himself. Supporting someone other than Clinton is not the same as supporting Trump. Not fearing Trump is not the same as supporting him either.
I think you guys are wrong when it comes to a Trump Presidency. There is not going to be a moment when things get so bad that the Dems will wake up and start giving us liberal choices.
The dems are corrupt and only corporate choices come from them.. to fix that will take time. If a republican get in charge.. are the temporary good things we have will be taken away and we will have to fight for those things again.
When Dem win office, we do have to fight, but at least we get good things from them.. one inch at a time. When a Republican win… they are against everything we want and they take a mile at a time.
As for destroying the Republican Party.. the dems had a chance to do that… when Obama got into office. But he covered for them and tried to work along with them. What happens if after a Trump presidency, we get compromising choices again with them only determine to fix one thing out of a dozen problems that were form.
Right now the Dem are holding us hostage against a bigger threat the republicans… but when the republicans gain power, we’re going to forget about why we dislike the dems and just fight against the Republican. . then the same routine again
The only way to change the dems.. is from within. If all the people who vote this election vote ever other election and primary, then we would eventually have change. I think if third party people went into the main parties as opponents, then we would get the shake up.. much like Bernie Sanders
> when the republicans gain power, we’re going to forget about why we dislike the dems and just fight against the Republican. . then the same routine again
You’re forgetting that those Corporatist Dems will be “fighting” Trump by allying themselves with various Republicans – all the ones who don’t like the Trump circus or have been kicked out from that circus. They’ll fight Trump from the “moderate” right, not from the left. And this (along with Trump himself) will progressively piss off progressives like never before, while swelling their ranks. Which is what we need.
You’re right about this being a hostage situation (i.e. the Democrats taking us hostage). When has a hostage situation ever ended well for the hostage takers? Especially when it keeps going and it just gets dragged out further and further…then the hostage takers are always f**ked by definition.
I’m sure he’s a really nice guy, but Steve-O just isn’t a good host. His public speaking is shaky, he gets sidetracked a lot, and his lack of organization is evident in his presentation skills in general. Sometimes it’s literally frustrating listening to him try and talk. Jimmy is on point, as per usual.
“..her campaign flowed the release of her health status. That gives us reasonable room to speculate, ” you say.
Really? How so, please clarify for me.
How come no one is speculating about why Trump’s face is so orange. Is he a chameleon stuck in neutral? Is that his body double that’s less orange than the original, or the orange body double ? Is he sick from a disease no one has discovered yet, and once elected president he’d share what it is and reveal secret cure produced by big pharma that will overnight turn his face a more normal color? What’s going on there? What about the aliens? Trump hasn’t released any real health records. Does that give “reasonable reason to speculate?” Yeah, you’re so liberal you dare speculate about a disease judging from the way a person walks and climbs stairs? Please clarify because I am starting to persuade myself indeed there is a line to be drawn somewhere, could be different from the Michael Shure line but there should be a line of decency drawn someplace and you’re definitely crossing . I think, I m not certain. Convince me otherwise should you care
Forgot Wes Clark Jr. He goes after John on the list only because he’s not on the show so often.
Wes has an interesting view on the world, rather gloomy I find. For instance, climate change will kill us – which could be true, cannot predict myself, our jobs are going to be taken by robots – cannot possibly be true for all jobs, for example, creativity is not a treat computers have. But even though he makes compeling arguments .
I would enjoy listening to a late night call in show he’d like to launch in TYT.
And I miss Old School. … I get they’re busy with the new shows, the election, bla bla, but TYT Old School is a treat. Give us a fresh episode p l e a s e
For instance, climate change will kill us – which could be true, cannot predict myself, our jobs are going to be taken by robots
It’s all definitely going to happen if we allow politics and the political system to continue to evolve in the way that they have been evolving. The establishment, corporations and the wealthy are totally uninterested in preventing global warming or in the longterm economic security of the lower classes. They figure that in the worst case scenario they can always pull up their metaphorical draw bridges, use military-policing force to stay on top, and/or literally retreat into gated communities, brand new cities, secluded islands, etc.
Not everyone can deal with the stark brutality of the above prediction, I very much realize that. And again, that is only IF we allow things to continue on their current course.
I was disappointed that John bought into Michael ‘s argument that Colin Powell ‘s “private ” emails should not be read. Bad judgment. Like I posted in another section, that made me go through some hideous sources trying to get the whole picture of the emails story. And did not get even close to the conclusions Cenk presented when he covered the story the next day. I was relieved Cenk covered them the next day. Agree with someone who commented thank you Cenk for getting your show back after Michael hijacked it the day before
I respect Michael for being so knowledgeable and well informed about US politics, Congress, Senate. But we are not watching C-Span after all, this is The Young Turks, precious gem in politics news, the best commentary.
My favorite hosts ever: Cenk (the very best , Ben , John, in that order.
I think I get why you guys / gals are so into Jimmy, he’s telling you what you want to hear. For me, who is on neither side – Jill or Hill, and can assess without bias, Jimmy goes way over the top in his commentary. It is annoying. Every time he is on the Friday power panel and happens to hijack the debate at some point , I catch myself going, shut up already, I got you, no need to yell at me , man.
Also, his commentary on Powell s emails was nowhere near as good as Cenk’s. He reads some material like a grandma, and then just looks at the camera and sits silent, going, look at that..isn’t it obvious, whatever needs to be obvious. Since I rarely watch and mostly listen to The Young Turks, I found that his way of doing the show makes it less enjoyable if you just listen. Not the same with the main show.
And to listento Jimmy go, isn’t it obvious is not why I tune in, to only have someone confirm and share a particular viewpoint of mine. I do because Main Hour One mostly, and Cenk, always manage to surprise me in going even deeper in his analysis. Since I watch the show the next day, I have gone through the news of the day already. But listening to TYT cover it is always new and refreshing.
On the other side, Jimmy rarely manages to surprise me. He’s the equivalent of other media guys who just keep pounding the same points over and over. I even find that his “passion” discredits him for me sometimes , I’m like, okay dude I got it , you’re “funny” and “passionate” but this is news not comedy (maybe I don’t share the same sense of humor, I dunno). I was genuinely surprised to see someone comment Jimmy’s journalism is the best ever. I disagree.
Anyway, I enjoy the show and, like someone else suggested also, would like to hear more from Steve Oh. I respect his thinking and the way he presents his position/opinion.
I continue supporting the network by being a member.
i love this comments section just from the sheer love of the TYT community who back progressive thinkers. secondly, it still surprises me how liberal steve oh is.
100% agree about michael shure being a total establishment pundit.
It is somewhat surprising in the context of Steve being the man who runs TYT’s financial side. The way that most content-creating outfits operate – especially newspapers – is that the writers and journalists tend to be more ideological and “gung ho” while the financial, bookkeeping side tends to be more “easy does it, tone the rhetoric down”.
Which is just more confirmation that TYT ain’t like any other outfit.
Michael comes from Al Jazeera. Hardly an establishment shill. He’s a thoughtful counterweight to the more strident Progressive voices, not unlike Ben. Need both voices for some balance. And TYT is blessed, so to speak, with a real depth of various progressive voices.
yah, i don’t mean to say he is a shill because it’s part of some contractual obligation. he genuinely believes in what he says. his views are very much within the realm of the establishment though; sometimes i find his arguments not thoughtful at all but that’s just my opinion. and i agree that these voices shouldn’t be silenced. all perspectives are welcome on TYT.
I absolutely LOVE your new show. Although you are supposedly a comedian, I disagree. I think you’re one of the finest journalists who really has his shit together.
Unlike many news shows, you don’t use the King’s English, but rather use the everyday vocabulary most of are accustomed to and explain issues in plain English. In other words, you relate to us folks who don’t sit with dictionaries in our laps.
I have listened to many news shows, and when they finished speaking, I still didn’t know what the hell they were saying. (And they probably didn’t either in their effort to kill time Sarah Palin style.)
You two fellows make a fine team and balance each other well.
And I must say you must have a most wonderful boss who allows you the journalistic freedom to disagree with him on your broadcasts.
So in closing I wish you the very best with your new show and eagerly look forward to viewing it every week!
Love the theory and hope that’d be how it’d turn out. But the problem is that if trump wins, all the republicans like Cruz that didn’t support Trump will just turn around and be like. See told you he wasn’t a real conservative, but we’re different
Also the problem is that if trump wins, all the republicans like Cruz that didn’t support Trump will just turn around and be like. See told you he wasn’t a real conservative, but we’re different
Trump is an incompetent loser, therefore, someone else will be running the government who is FAR more intelligent and focused on an agenda that, quite frankly, will NOT benefit the American people. Having said that, I too, will vote for Jill Stein.
Great show with lots of spirit. Your logic slays regarding killing the Republican party by not voting for HRC. Okay. But, my only problem is, the sheer mass of anti-nausea medication needed for a Tru** presidency is horrific, cannot be filled by current stockpiles. That fear, I don’t know.
Jimmy…Don’t you realize that if Hilary did have Parkinson’s it would make her more likely to get the presidency? Parkson’s sucks, but it wouldn’t destroy her presidency, it would actually draw in a great deal of sympathy votes…Also, you guys do do a great job here on Aggressive Progressives, but you guys really don’t have any experience in politics. I’ve grown up in a political family and have been active all my life. So active this past primary season that I was the Sander’s volunteer organizer in my congressional district in NY. I really don’t appreciate seeing you guys say anything against Senator Sanders. He was the one who started the political revolution and has been the most honest and trustworthy politician EVER; 40 years of hardwork and commitment! So, if you think for any reason that he “sold out” or some other crazy kind of shit you’re out of your mind. If you don’t understand how shit works on the inside, maybe it would help if you listened to other panelists like Mike, who may have different points of view and knowledge which may not have been of access to you…We always have something to learn from anyone and everyone, that’s the point of sharing information and it’s probably the reason why a lot of you are there at TYT…Not trying to criticize you guys by any means, but just wanted to add some constructive criticism. Keep up the good work guys!
Not out of our mind for thinking he sold out, I love Bernie and what he started. But that doesn’t make him a perfect man who should be absolved of criticism. Also to say these guys have no political experience, but you do because you grew up in a political family and volunteered for Bernie is crazy. I also volunteered for Bernie here in Iowa and guarantee Jimmy would have as well if he had time, but he’s spending his time getting the word out through covering rallies and doing shows like The Jimmy Dore Show, TYT main show, and now Aggressive Progressive. Maybe the only guy who can push the TYT power panels even farther to the left than they already are. Who’s to say whether door knocking or the shows drew in more people to primary/caucus. Steve Oh, Jimmy I think you guy’s are doing a fantastic job of keeping the movement going and doing it without sugar coating. You deliver the message, not to appeal, but to get across the rational progressive truth. Even if by the end only a handful of people agree with you, please keep doing what you are doing Jimmy
YESS to all of what you said and NO to all of what Mr or Mrs Burns 128 had to say. “I’ve grown up in a political family and have been active all my life” <——— THIS…means nothing to a true progressive, Hillary has been politically active all of her life, look what it brought us!
It doesn’t mean anything? Being politically active, and growing up in an environment where political debate, critical thinking, and the exchange of ideas makes a shit ton of difference. Jimmy wasn’t politically active until later in life, and that is obvious in the way he argues his points. He relies on feelings far too much, and not enough on logical analysis.
Burns128 is absolutely right. Senator Sanders has been fighting for all of us for longer than most of the viewers have been alive. We need him to continue the fight where he is, gaining as many allies as possible, and we must all do OUR part as well.
Even had Sanders gotten the nomination, and won the general, he would have faced a great deal of opposition during his presidency. We would still have to fight our current system from the ground up, and that is exactly what Senator Sanders is trying to help us accomplish.
LOL it is overrated. Burns saying he comes from a family of epxirnce means absolutely nothing. As a millennial you don’t need to come from a family of politics to know politics. Discrediting jimmy due to that fact is laughable. I see that’s what older people tend to say know is that “Well I come from a family that is in-depth about politics” BULLCRAP who cares lol. I come from a time of information and the internet and as long as you choose your sources correctly you know just as much as politicians and your so called family.
agreeing with you. everyone can and should be criticized if there is legitimate reason. bernie is a great politician and human being but that doesn’t mean people should stop saying truths. i think bernie conceded way too much (when it comes to repeating praises for HRC) but that’s life. the struggle continues!
Dude its people like you who make sanders supporters look bad. Everytime someone has constructive criticism about Sanders you and all the others like you call them out and say Sanders can do know wrong his track record speaks for itself blah blah blah. I’m a first-time voter and worked hard to spread the message of Bernie here in Hawaii. Also to discredit what Jimmy and Steve are saying because you have a political family and all that lol. You don’t need to have a family like yours to know politics anyone can look anything up so what you said in trying to discredit their opinion was laughable. Sanders did screw up and I wouldn’t call him a sellout but doing a 360 in what he was pushing for and saying during the primaries is questionable and wrong. I despise the sanders supporters who defend him and think he does know wrong. Bernie didn’t fight back hard enough and when proof of the DNC coming out cheating him he didn’t mutter a word. That’s what pisses people off is he does fight all the way to really shake things up.
Jimmy I love you, but I REALLY disagree strongly with something you said. I do NOT agree that Hillary will be a “one-termer” — you saw how the DNC was able to rig the Primary for Hillary this year. Can you imagine how well they will be able to manipulate the primary process once she and her “minions” (thanks Colin) have had 4 years to cement and strengthen their stranglehold over the DNC? There will be NO WAY that a primary challenge will be countenanced.
You make a lot of the fact that Hillary will not be able to deliver on the Progressive parts of the DNC platform, that she will get nothing done except those parts of her own RW agenda where the GOP agrees with her anyway. Well, that sounds an awful lot like the Obama Presidency, and — let’s see — who challenged Obama in 2012? That’s right – NOBODY.
To my mind this is by far the most dangerous thing about Hillary – if she wins, we can kiss our democracy goodbye. At least, the Democratic Party will be completely unworthy of its name (hell, it already is). This is why I strongly disagree with Bernie and others who think they can “fix” the DNC by “working from inside the organisation.” That NEVER works.
Nope – I hate to tell you, but if Hillary wins it will be HRC again in 2020 – even if they have to wheel her around in an Iron Lung. And after that, it will be her hand-picked successor, backed as well by all that sweet, sweet Donor Money and the endless mammon of the Clinton Foundation. I tell you, this is a watershed election – but the Great Danger We Face is not at all the loser idiot who is only interested in scamming a buck. It is a woman possessed by “unbridled ambition” (thanks again, Colin) who is bent on world domination. I know that sounds like hyperbole but if you think about it, it is true.
Imagine being on a plane, and the pilot and copilot die. The stewardess comes in to the cabin and says “We need a new pilot right now!”.
Two people step forward. The first has been a pilot for so many decades that she’s become completely corrupt. She’s going bump everyone to economy class, and has a deal with a foreign dictator to land all planes in his country, thousands of miles from where we’re supposed to go, just to get a back-hander from him.
The second guy keeps talking about throwing all the Mexicans out the door without a parachute, and asks questions about why we can’t just crash in to Mecca.
Jimmy Dore stands up and says “He’s a better pilot, because he doesn’t even know how to fly a plane”.
This is the most idiotic allegory I have ever heard. And it saddens me to say that I have seen it elsewhere on the Interwebs. Are you seriously comparing our system of Government to an airliner? Tell me, where is the Congress in this scenario? Was the plane supposed to have taken off in 1776? If so, how much fuel did it have? Was it supposed to fly endlessly, or was it ever supposed to land? Ad if it were always destined to land somewhere, then WHERE was it supposed to land?
If there are parachutes on board why can’t everyone use them?
And finally, you should know that no one says “stewardess” anymore. The correct term is “flight attendant” – which tells me that the original version of this story started with some crazy old uncle when they let him use the PC in the Day Room.
> Are you seriously comparing our system of Government to an airliner?
People always do this thing where if you can find *anything* that separates two things being compared the comparison is invalid in total. Any two none identical things will have differences, it’s an asinine form of argument to point it out like it matters.
If you want to attack my point, say why it makes sense to favor a far more malicious choice based on them also being incompetent. Saying that the comparison is “the most idiotic allegory you’ve ever heard” because it doesn’t extend as far as there being a Congress on-board an airplane is ridiculous.
>no one says “stewardess” anymore
I just said stewardess. It is also the correct term.
>the original version of this story
I didn’t get the “story” from anywhere. It’s a pretty obvious metaphor.
Because pilots are the only people that are competent enough to fly a plane, but presidents aren’t the only people who run the country. Congress has a role, state governments have a role, local governments have a role and activism has a role. That’s why the analogy doesn’t work.
As for the argument, these guys in the show said it themselves: there’s not enough of a difference between the two parties to make it worth choosing one over the other. Both love corporations, both love war and international terrorism and both love the revolving door between government and lobbying, all of which are playing roles in screwing the bottom 99%. The two major political candidates are a bit of an anomaly, because they’re different, but they’re both terrible in their different ways that will lead to terrible policies. So, what many people (including myself) are going to try to do with our vote this election is to give the Greens more infrastructure. If Jill Stein receives 5% this year, that’s $10 million to the Green Party coffers for the next cycle, which can help pull the Dems farther left.
That would be a valid analogy…if politicians were just a bunch of experts trying to efficiently operate a machine. Except, that is totally not what politics is about.
Hillary’s corruption is not just a problem in and of itself (which it is, but it’s more than that): the core problem of her corruption is that it guarantees her implementing rightwing ideology. If you’re beholden to billionaires, the wealthy and corporations, then you’re beholden to the rightwing, neoliberal program that they want you to implement (regardless of what the voters want).
This reduces the election to a choice between two rightwing, neoliberal candidates, with only small variations between them. In other words, there is no opposition at this level. Surely the real death of democracy is that all candidates want essentially the same thing (just like in, say, China).
The analogy doesn’t work in that there aren’t any left/right pilots. They all just have to fly the plane. A pilot being corrupt on the side of his job doesn’t affect the core of that job. However decadent and unethical his personal life might become, this is never going to make him want to crash the plane, or not safely reach the destination of the flight.
Because that’s the politician’s real job: deciding what the destination IS. The politician is not the pilot, he’s the CEO and the shareholders board of the airline.
Jimmy I am a supporter of yours. Shut the fuck up when you get the idea to name a specific disease that you do not have background to speculate on. At that point you cross the line to becoming evil yourself. The rest of your commentary is diminished by your irresponsible speculation about a specific neurological disease. It makes you look unhinged instead of the aggressive progressive. Also please do not talk about nailing women in your progressive voice. It hurts.
Not necessarily evil, but certainly very crackpotty. And that’s not a good look or a good reputation for a Left-winger to have, and it harms the movement over all. Unlike most viewers, I’m not a Jill Stein supporter, but I agree that it’s important that everyone in the Left not look like a bunch of conspiracy theorist nutjobs.
So again Jimmy, stop saying this shit about Hillary. I don’t like her, you don’t like her. That’s not a reason to lie (or to repeat a lie) about her.
Er, so who gets to decide that the movement “doesn’t look right?” 1) That’s superficial thinking, 2) It is too preoccupied with, and gives too much credit to, the opinions of the movement’s enemies, and 3) by definition, any large social/political movement has its fair share of genuine crackpots (NOT referring to Jimmy obviously), just like society itself does, something that is both unavoidable and not a problem for any determined movement.
Plenty of genuine crackpots will be voting for Hillary in November, mainly because the status quo has made them materially comfortable.
I agree that saying saying that Hillary has Parkinson’s is probably a bad idea, however, the point Jimmy was trying to make was that since her campaign fowled up the release of her health status, that gives us reasonable room to speculate.
From heat exhaustion to flu to pneumonia, the campaign just couldn’t get its story straight and it’s still unclear what Hillary’s problem really is. However, what we can be clear about is that the Hillary 2016 camp doesn’t want to tell us the truth, which is why I agree that it is certainly fair to speculate until they answer up with some proof of her condition. In my opinion pneumonia is likely a lie, and if the truth is harder to swallow (i.e. something worse that pneumonia) then something like Parkinson’s may not be out of the question. The bigger issue is that the Clintons are the epitome of opaqueness, and this consistently hurts them and causes the trustworthiness/unfavorable problems that they so duly deserve.
Good that you bring out Iraq war… Paul Ryan is not gonna shepperd this to the house ? Really ? Once again you forget the Bush years. What happen in the case of a huge terrorist attack in the US ? You think Trump and Ryan wouldn’t vote for a massive war, or a ban on muslim ? Bush junior was as incompetent as Trump, but it was the Cheney and the Rumsfeld that conducted their policies. Bush sent 30 000 boys dying in Iraq for nothing, that’s the cold truth. Obama didn’t, in 8 year and with Hillary as a secretary of state do anything close to that. You keep repeating and repeating Trump wouldnt be able to do shit but thats WRONG he’ll have the house and the senate, and the slightest terrorist attack will become bills passed through the house. Forget your freedom, press, etc… You’ll have ROGER AILES and BANNON running things behind him. That’s what you want really ? Ailes litteraly had a black room to spy on his rivals, and you think you can put him for 4 years in the white house in those times of war and have it easy ?
If there is a Trump presidency there will not be another 4 years for our country. trump and his bullies will pulverize the entire Congress, the Supreme Court and local governmental agencies. The KKK will take over, there will be riots in the streets. Mosques will be bombed. This will lead to buses being bombed. Shit will hit the fan.
Believe Me! This is my prediction if they vote this sociopath into office.
Scary as hell.
Mark
Comments
I think you’ve imported the blame the voters for voting a third party bit from us in Australia. We’ve been hearing it for decades.
Great show, again. I love this, it smoothes my progressive soul. Keep up the excellent work!
I’m super late to post; but I loved Steve’s good cop bad cop analogy. It’s perfect for the place we find ourselves after decades of democrats campaigning and governing on the defense with “compromise” after “compromise”.
Update for 9/22 show??
Where is Sept 22nd!
Is this going to be the norm? We have to hope and pray for the next video to come out on demand? I love AP and TYT but this is discouraging. I need my fix of Jimmy Dore! :)
Yeah! where is my aggressive progressive!?! I need it now!
The sept 22nd show in’t there; I’m so sad :,(
In the meantime, you could watch some of the Jimmy Dore Show. One recent segment that is especially good is called “Sander’s Supporter Tells Hillary How To Get Her Vote – in 6 Easy Steps”. It’s beautiful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuczmdowehU
Agreed!
Where’s the 09/22 show?
Steve needs his pic on the banner too! Love the show.
Trump gets elected you will finally see total establishment bipartisan action, they’ll impeach him rapidly, Pence is who is the actual danger.
In the banner, Steve’s image should be there sorta “hovering” over Jimmy while the latter’s doing the pointing.
Another great show, really loving this new member feature. Although would reaally enjoy a more frequent show, like atleast twice a week!
Also, gotta agree on Michael.. Like he seems like a great guy, and I love when he’s on Old School and stuff. But over the years he has grown more and more establishment. Such a shame. Anyway hey, it is nice to get more viewpoints! Great show, though–pumped for the next one tomorrow!
I can’t wait til Trump is president and Jimmy goes to his republican friends to help “fight” him only to find them spitting in his face right behind their dear leader. You have literally no reason to think any of this will happen but just need to justify the continued argument likening Hillary to Trump. This stupid fantasy is getting irritating and if you’re going to continue to use the excuse of being comedian to not understand reality then please only wear a clown costume going forward. I don’t say this because I worry about Hillary but because you’re now a liberal version of fact free, emotion filled fox news. Jimmy needs to fix his brain on this because I always thought he was great forever up until the primary ended but it appears something triggered a major lapse of reason he cannot overcome. You’re definitely smarter than this
Oh, gimme a break. “His republican friends?” That is so clearly rhetoric at its most lazy and unintelligent, LOL.
Maybe it would be that if I only wrote that one sentence. I’m obviously being facetious and mocking his absurd theory. What’s lazy and unintelligent is speculating that there will be a kumbaya moment with liberals and conservatives against Trump and forget the supreme court and any and all environmental regulations, food regulations, etc. I think others should actually take a break and some deep breathes because these guys are not using their brains in considering what the GOP will be able to pass with control of house, senate and presidency. Jimmy especially took the primary race waaay too personal and now just want to stick it to the dems. If Bernie never ran against Hillary we would not even be having these conversations at all.
> Jimmy especially took the primary race waaay too personal and now just want to stick it to the dems.
You think this is about vengeance and petty things like that? (It’s telling that your understanding of politics apparently operates as this base level where it’s all about vendettas, tribes, personalities, factionalism, and hurt pride) By definition, if you’re an “aggressive progressive” then you care more about progressivism than about any such pettiness.
What a progressive should take seriously is the long Democratic drift towards the Right, which started sometime in the late 80’s, which was accelerated by the Clintons in the 90’s, and which has basically robbed us of a leftwing party that isn’t corporatist, corrupt and beholden to the business class. That was already my analysis 15 years ago and everything that has happened since then has only confirmed it, making abundantly clear what should be done: stop supporting these rightwing Democrats who keep traveling towards the Right and becoming more corrupt along with the system itself. For me, Clinton has already been the ultimate symbol of what’s gone wrong in the political system for a very long time, and everything that happened during the primaries merely confirmed my analysis once again, and re-emphasized the conclusion: such Democrats are a side of politics to be fought and defeated, tooth and nail.
“By definition, if you’re an “aggressive progressive” then you care more about progressivism than about any such pettiness.” – Now you’re just making things up and if you can’t see the bitterness then you’re blind.
I don’t disagree with your position about the dems. They absolutely have their flaws and I voted for Sanders because of that. My critique is about Jimmy’s theory which essentially advocates for Trump over Clinton. He can say all day that it doesn’t but that is the logical conclusion to what he is saying. Watch him again if you don’t think so. It is an idiotic theory with no facts or history to back it up and when he is challenged on it he simply diverts attention to Clinton’s negatives while ignoring the insanity that will ensue with Trump and GOP controlled house and senate. That is not theory. That will literally happen and the idea that the GOP will “fracture” and won’t pass much of Paul Ryan and Trump’s agendas is nonsense. They will push this country further right than Clinton ever will and voting for someone I dislike to stop that is not my favorite option but the only actual one.
It’s also worth remembering that Jimmy did much to make us aware of just how frightening Trump, and especially his “deplorable” followers were when he covered the Trump rallies. More than any other “reporter” covering a Trump rally, he exposed how terrifying these supporters were and the extent to which MSM reporters were failing in their responsibilities when covering Trump. It’s somewhat disingenuous now to argue that Trump and his supporters aren’t actually the crazy, bigoted, hate-filled maniacs that he once convinced us they were. Were you right then Jimmy, or are you right now?
@janachovich
It’s not possible to find your critique when it’s wrapped up in a bunch of stuff that is centered purely on Jimmy’s person – “he’s stupid, he’s friends with Republicans, he’s bitter, he’s irrational”, etc. That’s what I mean by petty.
I might be in the habit of calling Ben and Michael “establishment” – which, anyway, they themselves would not go out of their way to deny – but I would never say that this has anything to do with a character flaw or personal deficiency on their part. They are just on that side of the equation, like some people are, for bigger reasons. Jimmy is definitely on a different side of the equation, and so am I.
Clinton is the core, the dark heart, of what’s wrong with the system. Trump is not. Trump is a superface symptom; a serious symptom but a symptom nonetheless. Nor is it surprising to see it emerge – in fact, it makes perfect logical sense. Am I going to let a symptom distract me from the disease? No, not in a million years.
> Trump is a superface symptom
Obviously I meant to write “Trump is a surface symptom”. Funnily enough, from its Latin etymological roots, “superface” has the same semantic meaning as “surface” even though it is a typo.
You’re just misreading my comment. I called HIS THEORY stupid. I am making fun of his idea of coming together with republicans against Trump, not dissing him having republican friends. I have republican friends. They all love Trump. I still even like Jimmy because I can separate those things. I’ve seen him argue this point so many times and he always ends up circling the wagons when faced with real push back on the basis of it being a choice between Trump and Clinton. He won’t admit that and if you can’t see how disingenuous it is then you’re falling for confirmation bias because it’s obvious. And if someone gets him in a corner he’ll fall back to the “just a comedian” defense but he actually has a pretty damn large platform as a political pundit, call it what you will. That is all and if you want to defend his theory go ahead but really not looking to debate Trump vs Clinton.
Fair enough, but you still use a great deal of personalized language. When people critique a theory, usually the language involved is more about the theory and less about the person.
It is flat out wrong to say Jimmy supports Trump over Clinton. He supports Stein over Clinton and isn’t willing to compromise his principles over hyped up fear over Trump. He said so himself. Supporting someone other than Clinton is not the same as supporting Trump. Not fearing Trump is not the same as supporting him either.
Depends on where you are due to electoral system. 5 to 7 states decide, everywhere else vote how you want.
Yeah, needless to say, nobody loves AG Insurance. :)
I think you guys are wrong when it comes to a Trump Presidency. There is not going to be a moment when things get so bad that the Dems will wake up and start giving us liberal choices.
The dems are corrupt and only corporate choices come from them.. to fix that will take time. If a republican get in charge.. are the temporary good things we have will be taken away and we will have to fight for those things again.
When Dem win office, we do have to fight, but at least we get good things from them.. one inch at a time. When a Republican win… they are against everything we want and they take a mile at a time.
As for destroying the Republican Party.. the dems had a chance to do that… when Obama got into office. But he covered for them and tried to work along with them. What happens if after a Trump presidency, we get compromising choices again with them only determine to fix one thing out of a dozen problems that were form.
Right now the Dem are holding us hostage against a bigger threat the republicans… but when the republicans gain power, we’re going to forget about why we dislike the dems and just fight against the Republican. . then the same routine again
The only way to change the dems.. is from within. If all the people who vote this election vote ever other election and primary, then we would eventually have change. I think if third party people went into the main parties as opponents, then we would get the shake up.. much like Bernie Sanders
> when the republicans gain power, we’re going to forget about why we dislike the dems and just fight against the Republican. . then the same routine again
You’re forgetting that those Corporatist Dems will be “fighting” Trump by allying themselves with various Republicans – all the ones who don’t like the Trump circus or have been kicked out from that circus. They’ll fight Trump from the “moderate” right, not from the left. And this (along with Trump himself) will progressively piss off progressives like never before, while swelling their ranks. Which is what we need.
You’re right about this being a hostage situation (i.e. the Democrats taking us hostage). When has a hostage situation ever ended well for the hostage takers? Especially when it keeps going and it just gets dragged out further and further…then the hostage takers are always f**ked by definition.
Im sorry, but aggressive progressive should be hour 3 of the mainshow, this once a week nonsense is barely acceptable.
As it stands, its the only reason i keep that sub rolling.
Especially after all this hardcore hilary stumping.
As a long time member.I got to say Loved this week’s episode. Thanks for keeping it real.
Jimmy – bombs are our 2nd largest export, garbage is our largest.
I’m sure he’s a really nice guy, but Steve-O just isn’t a good host. His public speaking is shaky, he gets sidetracked a lot, and his lack of organization is evident in his presentation skills in general. Sometimes it’s literally frustrating listening to him try and talk. Jimmy is on point, as per usual.
Steve is super smart, so he actually thinks before he speaks. Give him time, then listen carefully.
“..her campaign flowed the release of her health status. That gives us reasonable room to speculate, ” you say.
Really? How so, please clarify for me.
How come no one is speculating about why Trump’s face is so orange. Is he a chameleon stuck in neutral? Is that his body double that’s less orange than the original, or the orange body double ? Is he sick from a disease no one has discovered yet, and once elected president he’d share what it is and reveal secret cure produced by big pharma that will overnight turn his face a more normal color? What’s going on there? What about the aliens? Trump hasn’t released any real health records. Does that give “reasonable reason to speculate?” Yeah, you’re so liberal you dare speculate about a disease judging from the way a person walks and climbs stairs? Please clarify because I am starting to persuade myself indeed there is a line to be drawn somewhere, could be different from the Michael Shure line but there should be a line of decency drawn someplace and you’re definitely crossing . I think, I m not certain. Convince me otherwise should you care
Forgot Wes Clark Jr. He goes after John on the list only because he’s not on the show so often.
Wes has an interesting view on the world, rather gloomy I find. For instance, climate change will kill us – which could be true, cannot predict myself, our jobs are going to be taken by robots – cannot possibly be true for all jobs, for example, creativity is not a treat computers have. But even though he makes compeling arguments .
I would enjoy listening to a late night call in show he’d like to launch in TYT.
And I miss Old School. … I get they’re busy with the new shows, the election, bla bla, but TYT Old School is a treat. Give us a fresh episode p l e a s e
It’s all definitely going to happen if we allow politics and the political system to continue to evolve in the way that they have been evolving. The establishment, corporations and the wealthy are totally uninterested in preventing global warming or in the longterm economic security of the lower classes. They figure that in the worst case scenario they can always pull up their metaphorical draw bridges, use military-policing force to stay on top, and/or literally retreat into gated communities, brand new cities, secluded islands, etc.
Not everyone can deal with the stark brutality of the above prediction, I very much realize that. And again, that is only IF we allow things to continue on their current course.
I was disappointed that John bought into Michael ‘s argument that Colin Powell ‘s “private ” emails should not be read. Bad judgment. Like I posted in another section, that made me go through some hideous sources trying to get the whole picture of the emails story. And did not get even close to the conclusions Cenk presented when he covered the story the next day. I was relieved Cenk covered them the next day. Agree with someone who commented thank you Cenk for getting your show back after Michael hijacked it the day before
I respect Michael for being so knowledgeable and well informed about US politics, Congress, Senate. But we are not watching C-Span after all, this is The Young Turks, precious gem in politics news, the best commentary.
My favorite hosts ever: Cenk (the very best , Ben , John, in that order.
I think I get why you guys / gals are so into Jimmy, he’s telling you what you want to hear. For me, who is on neither side – Jill or Hill, and can assess without bias, Jimmy goes way over the top in his commentary. It is annoying. Every time he is on the Friday power panel and happens to hijack the debate at some point , I catch myself going, shut up already, I got you, no need to yell at me , man.
Also, his commentary on Powell s emails was nowhere near as good as Cenk’s. He reads some material like a grandma, and then just looks at the camera and sits silent, going, look at that..isn’t it obvious, whatever needs to be obvious. Since I rarely watch and mostly listen to The Young Turks, I found that his way of doing the show makes it less enjoyable if you just listen. Not the same with the main show.
And to listento Jimmy go, isn’t it obvious is not why I tune in, to only have someone confirm and share a particular viewpoint of mine. I do because Main Hour One mostly, and Cenk, always manage to surprise me in going even deeper in his analysis. Since I watch the show the next day, I have gone through the news of the day already. But listening to TYT cover it is always new and refreshing.
On the other side, Jimmy rarely manages to surprise me. He’s the equivalent of other media guys who just keep pounding the same points over and over. I even find that his “passion” discredits him for me sometimes , I’m like, okay dude I got it , you’re “funny” and “passionate” but this is news not comedy (maybe I don’t share the same sense of humor, I dunno). I was genuinely surprised to see someone comment Jimmy’s journalism is the best ever. I disagree.
Anyway, I enjoy the show and, like someone else suggested also, would like to hear more from Steve Oh. I respect his thinking and the way he presents his position/opinion.
I continue supporting the network by being a member.
i love this comments section just from the sheer love of the TYT community who back progressive thinkers. secondly, it still surprises me how liberal steve oh is.
100% agree about michael shure being a total establishment pundit.
It is somewhat surprising in the context of Steve being the man who runs TYT’s financial side. The way that most content-creating outfits operate – especially newspapers – is that the writers and journalists tend to be more ideological and “gung ho” while the financial, bookkeeping side tends to be more “easy does it, tone the rhetoric down”.
Which is just more confirmation that TYT ain’t like any other outfit.
Michael comes from Al Jazeera. Hardly an establishment shill. He’s a thoughtful counterweight to the more strident Progressive voices, not unlike Ben. Need both voices for some balance. And TYT is blessed, so to speak, with a real depth of various progressive voices.
yah, i don’t mean to say he is a shill because it’s part of some contractual obligation. he genuinely believes in what he says. his views are very much within the realm of the establishment though; sometimes i find his arguments not thoughtful at all but that’s just my opinion. and i agree that these voices shouldn’t be silenced. all perspectives are welcome on TYT.
45:00: Couldn’t be more right about Michael Shure! I’m sick of his appearances on the show. The man is an apologist to his core.
I absolutely LOVE your new show. Although you are supposedly a comedian, I disagree. I think you’re one of the finest journalists who really has his shit together.
Unlike many news shows, you don’t use the King’s English, but rather use the everyday vocabulary most of are accustomed to and explain issues in plain English. In other words, you relate to us folks who don’t sit with dictionaries in our laps.
I have listened to many news shows, and when they finished speaking, I still didn’t know what the hell they were saying. (And they probably didn’t either in their effort to kill time Sarah Palin style.)
You two fellows make a fine team and balance each other well.
And I must say you must have a most wonderful boss who allows you the journalistic freedom to disagree with him on your broadcasts.
So in closing I wish you the very best with your new show and eagerly look forward to viewing it every week!
Well said. :-)
Even if Trump wins, the corporate Dems will continue to rig elections in the future.
Thanks Jimmy and Steve, if you want to replace Cenk and Ana, you have my vote!This is the greatest political news show on the planet!
Love the theory and hope that’d be how it’d turn out. But the problem is that if trump wins, all the republicans like Cruz that didn’t support Trump will just turn around and be like. See told you he wasn’t a real conservative, but we’re different
Also the problem is that if trump wins, all the republicans like Cruz that didn’t support Trump will just turn around and be like. See told you he wasn’t a real conservative, but we’re different
Trump is an incompetent loser, therefore, someone else will be running the government who is FAR more intelligent and focused on an agenda that, quite frankly, will NOT benefit the American people. Having said that, I too, will vote for Jill Stein.
“Vote for Hillary, is that what you’re gonna say? Cause I swear to fuckin’ god!” hahaahahahaha
Hahaha Jimmy annoys the crap out of me, but you gotta love the passion! Steve you gotta jump in more, though! Great show, aggressive progressives!
Great show with lots of spirit. Your logic slays regarding killing the Republican party by not voting for HRC. Okay. But, my only problem is, the sheer mass of anti-nausea medication needed for a Tru** presidency is horrific, cannot be filled by current stockpiles. That fear, I don’t know.
Y’all need a TYT debate, Clinton vs. Third Party.
Jimmy, we will have to fight whoever is president. Republicans or Democrats we will have to fight.
Also Bush didn’t galvanize the left and destroy the right, what makes you think it would happen for sure with Trump. Feelings don’t mean shit.
Jimmy…Don’t you realize that if Hilary did have Parkinson’s it would make her more likely to get the presidency? Parkson’s sucks, but it wouldn’t destroy her presidency, it would actually draw in a great deal of sympathy votes…Also, you guys do do a great job here on Aggressive Progressives, but you guys really don’t have any experience in politics. I’ve grown up in a political family and have been active all my life. So active this past primary season that I was the Sander’s volunteer organizer in my congressional district in NY. I really don’t appreciate seeing you guys say anything against Senator Sanders. He was the one who started the political revolution and has been the most honest and trustworthy politician EVER; 40 years of hardwork and commitment! So, if you think for any reason that he “sold out” or some other crazy kind of shit you’re out of your mind. If you don’t understand how shit works on the inside, maybe it would help if you listened to other panelists like Mike, who may have different points of view and knowledge which may not have been of access to you…We always have something to learn from anyone and everyone, that’s the point of sharing information and it’s probably the reason why a lot of you are there at TYT…Not trying to criticize you guys by any means, but just wanted to add some constructive criticism. Keep up the good work guys!
love your assessment – passions burns reason at times, we just watch the fire
Not out of our mind for thinking he sold out, I love Bernie and what he started. But that doesn’t make him a perfect man who should be absolved of criticism. Also to say these guys have no political experience, but you do because you grew up in a political family and volunteered for Bernie is crazy. I also volunteered for Bernie here in Iowa and guarantee Jimmy would have as well if he had time, but he’s spending his time getting the word out through covering rallies and doing shows like The Jimmy Dore Show, TYT main show, and now Aggressive Progressive. Maybe the only guy who can push the TYT power panels even farther to the left than they already are. Who’s to say whether door knocking or the shows drew in more people to primary/caucus. Steve Oh, Jimmy I think you guy’s are doing a fantastic job of keeping the movement going and doing it without sugar coating. You deliver the message, not to appeal, but to get across the rational progressive truth. Even if by the end only a handful of people agree with you, please keep doing what you are doing Jimmy
YESS to all of what you said and NO to all of what Mr or Mrs Burns 128 had to say. “I’ve grown up in a political family and have been active all my life” <——— THIS…means nothing to a true progressive, Hillary has been politically active all of her life, look what it brought us!
It doesn’t mean anything? Being politically active, and growing up in an environment where political debate, critical thinking, and the exchange of ideas makes a shit ton of difference. Jimmy wasn’t politically active until later in life, and that is obvious in the way he argues his points. He relies on feelings far too much, and not enough on logical analysis.
Burns128 is absolutely right. Senator Sanders has been fighting for all of us for longer than most of the viewers have been alive. We need him to continue the fight where he is, gaining as many allies as possible, and we must all do OUR part as well.
Even had Sanders gotten the nomination, and won the general, he would have faced a great deal of opposition during his presidency. We would still have to fight our current system from the ground up, and that is exactly what Senator Sanders is trying to help us accomplish.
LOL it is overrated. Burns saying he comes from a family of epxirnce means absolutely nothing. As a millennial you don’t need to come from a family of politics to know politics. Discrediting jimmy due to that fact is laughable. I see that’s what older people tend to say know is that “Well I come from a family that is in-depth about politics” BULLCRAP who cares lol. I come from a time of information and the internet and as long as you choose your sources correctly you know just as much as politicians and your so called family.
agreeing with you. everyone can and should be criticized if there is legitimate reason. bernie is a great politician and human being but that doesn’t mean people should stop saying truths. i think bernie conceded way too much (when it comes to repeating praises for HRC) but that’s life. the struggle continues!
Dude its people like you who make sanders supporters look bad. Everytime someone has constructive criticism about Sanders you and all the others like you call them out and say Sanders can do know wrong his track record speaks for itself blah blah blah. I’m a first-time voter and worked hard to spread the message of Bernie here in Hawaii. Also to discredit what Jimmy and Steve are saying because you have a political family and all that lol. You don’t need to have a family like yours to know politics anyone can look anything up so what you said in trying to discredit their opinion was laughable. Sanders did screw up and I wouldn’t call him a sellout but doing a 360 in what he was pushing for and saying during the primaries is questionable and wrong. I despise the sanders supporters who defend him and think he does know wrong. Bernie didn’t fight back hard enough and when proof of the DNC coming out cheating him he didn’t mutter a word. That’s what pisses people off is he does fight all the way to really shake things up.
Nice one!
Jimmy I love you, but I REALLY disagree strongly with something you said. I do NOT agree that Hillary will be a “one-termer” — you saw how the DNC was able to rig the Primary for Hillary this year. Can you imagine how well they will be able to manipulate the primary process once she and her “minions” (thanks Colin) have had 4 years to cement and strengthen their stranglehold over the DNC? There will be NO WAY that a primary challenge will be countenanced.
You make a lot of the fact that Hillary will not be able to deliver on the Progressive parts of the DNC platform, that she will get nothing done except those parts of her own RW agenda where the GOP agrees with her anyway. Well, that sounds an awful lot like the Obama Presidency, and — let’s see — who challenged Obama in 2012? That’s right – NOBODY.
To my mind this is by far the most dangerous thing about Hillary – if she wins, we can kiss our democracy goodbye. At least, the Democratic Party will be completely unworthy of its name (hell, it already is). This is why I strongly disagree with Bernie and others who think they can “fix” the DNC by “working from inside the organisation.” That NEVER works.
Nope – I hate to tell you, but if Hillary wins it will be HRC again in 2020 – even if they have to wheel her around in an Iron Lung. And after that, it will be her hand-picked successor, backed as well by all that sweet, sweet Donor Money and the endless mammon of the Clinton Foundation. I tell you, this is a watershed election – but the Great Danger We Face is not at all the loser idiot who is only interested in scamming a buck. It is a woman possessed by “unbridled ambition” (thanks again, Colin) who is bent on world domination. I know that sounds like hyperbole but if you think about it, it is true.
> even if they have to wheel her around in an Iron Lung
If and when that comes to pass, she’ll certainly be less “Iron Lady” and more “Iron Lung Lady”. :)
Imagine being on a plane, and the pilot and copilot die. The stewardess comes in to the cabin and says “We need a new pilot right now!”.
Two people step forward. The first has been a pilot for so many decades that she’s become completely corrupt. She’s going bump everyone to economy class, and has a deal with a foreign dictator to land all planes in his country, thousands of miles from where we’re supposed to go, just to get a back-hander from him.
The second guy keeps talking about throwing all the Mexicans out the door without a parachute, and asks questions about why we can’t just crash in to Mecca.
Jimmy Dore stands up and says “He’s a better pilot, because he doesn’t even know how to fly a plane”.
This is the most idiotic allegory I have ever heard. And it saddens me to say that I have seen it elsewhere on the Interwebs. Are you seriously comparing our system of Government to an airliner? Tell me, where is the Congress in this scenario? Was the plane supposed to have taken off in 1776? If so, how much fuel did it have? Was it supposed to fly endlessly, or was it ever supposed to land? Ad if it were always destined to land somewhere, then WHERE was it supposed to land?
If there are parachutes on board why can’t everyone use them?
And finally, you should know that no one says “stewardess” anymore. The correct term is “flight attendant” – which tells me that the original version of this story started with some crazy old uncle when they let him use the PC in the Day Room.
> Are you seriously comparing our system of Government to an airliner?
People always do this thing where if you can find *anything* that separates two things being compared the comparison is invalid in total. Any two none identical things will have differences, it’s an asinine form of argument to point it out like it matters.
If you want to attack my point, say why it makes sense to favor a far more malicious choice based on them also being incompetent. Saying that the comparison is “the most idiotic allegory you’ve ever heard” because it doesn’t extend as far as there being a Congress on-board an airplane is ridiculous.
>no one says “stewardess” anymore
I just said stewardess. It is also the correct term.
>the original version of this story
I didn’t get the “story” from anywhere. It’s a pretty obvious metaphor.
Because pilots are the only people that are competent enough to fly a plane, but presidents aren’t the only people who run the country. Congress has a role, state governments have a role, local governments have a role and activism has a role. That’s why the analogy doesn’t work.
As for the argument, these guys in the show said it themselves: there’s not enough of a difference between the two parties to make it worth choosing one over the other. Both love corporations, both love war and international terrorism and both love the revolving door between government and lobbying, all of which are playing roles in screwing the bottom 99%. The two major political candidates are a bit of an anomaly, because they’re different, but they’re both terrible in their different ways that will lead to terrible policies. So, what many people (including myself) are going to try to do with our vote this election is to give the Greens more infrastructure. If Jill Stein receives 5% this year, that’s $10 million to the Green Party coffers for the next cycle, which can help pull the Dems farther left.
That would be a valid analogy…if politicians were just a bunch of experts trying to efficiently operate a machine. Except, that is totally not what politics is about.
Hillary’s corruption is not just a problem in and of itself (which it is, but it’s more than that): the core problem of her corruption is that it guarantees her implementing rightwing ideology. If you’re beholden to billionaires, the wealthy and corporations, then you’re beholden to the rightwing, neoliberal program that they want you to implement (regardless of what the voters want).
This reduces the election to a choice between two rightwing, neoliberal candidates, with only small variations between them. In other words, there is no opposition at this level. Surely the real death of democracy is that all candidates want essentially the same thing (just like in, say, China).
The analogy doesn’t work in that there aren’t any left/right pilots. They all just have to fly the plane. A pilot being corrupt on the side of his job doesn’t affect the core of that job. However decadent and unethical his personal life might become, this is never going to make him want to crash the plane, or not safely reach the destination of the flight.
Because that’s the politician’s real job: deciding what the destination IS. The politician is not the pilot, he’s the CEO and the shareholders board of the airline.
Jimmy I am a supporter of yours. Shut the fuck up when you get the idea to name a specific disease that you do not have background to speculate on. At that point you cross the line to becoming evil yourself. The rest of your commentary is diminished by your irresponsible speculation about a specific neurological disease. It makes you look unhinged instead of the aggressive progressive. Also please do not talk about nailing women in your progressive voice. It hurts.
Not necessarily evil, but certainly very crackpotty. And that’s not a good look or a good reputation for a Left-winger to have, and it harms the movement over all. Unlike most viewers, I’m not a Jill Stein supporter, but I agree that it’s important that everyone in the Left not look like a bunch of conspiracy theorist nutjobs.
So again Jimmy, stop saying this shit about Hillary. I don’t like her, you don’t like her. That’s not a reason to lie (or to repeat a lie) about her.
Er, so who gets to decide that the movement “doesn’t look right?” 1) That’s superficial thinking, 2) It is too preoccupied with, and gives too much credit to, the opinions of the movement’s enemies, and 3) by definition, any large social/political movement has its fair share of genuine crackpots (NOT referring to Jimmy obviously), just like society itself does, something that is both unavoidable and not a problem for any determined movement.
Plenty of genuine crackpots will be voting for Hillary in November, mainly because the status quo has made them materially comfortable.
I agree that saying saying that Hillary has Parkinson’s is probably a bad idea, however, the point Jimmy was trying to make was that since her campaign fowled up the release of her health status, that gives us reasonable room to speculate.
From heat exhaustion to flu to pneumonia, the campaign just couldn’t get its story straight and it’s still unclear what Hillary’s problem really is. However, what we can be clear about is that the Hillary 2016 camp doesn’t want to tell us the truth, which is why I agree that it is certainly fair to speculate until they answer up with some proof of her condition. In my opinion pneumonia is likely a lie, and if the truth is harder to swallow (i.e. something worse that pneumonia) then something like Parkinson’s may not be out of the question. The bigger issue is that the Clintons are the epitome of opaqueness, and this consistently hurts them and causes the trustworthiness/unfavorable problems that they so duly deserve.
Why isn’t the video link available for PA episode 4???
Good that you bring out Iraq war… Paul Ryan is not gonna shepperd this to the house ? Really ? Once again you forget the Bush years. What happen in the case of a huge terrorist attack in the US ? You think Trump and Ryan wouldn’t vote for a massive war, or a ban on muslim ? Bush junior was as incompetent as Trump, but it was the Cheney and the Rumsfeld that conducted their policies. Bush sent 30 000 boys dying in Iraq for nothing, that’s the cold truth. Obama didn’t, in 8 year and with Hillary as a secretary of state do anything close to that. You keep repeating and repeating Trump wouldnt be able to do shit but thats WRONG he’ll have the house and the senate, and the slightest terrorist attack will become bills passed through the house. Forget your freedom, press, etc… You’ll have ROGER AILES and BANNON running things behind him. That’s what you want really ? Ailes litteraly had a black room to spy on his rivals, and you think you can put him for 4 years in the white house in those times of war and have it easy ?
If there is a Trump presidency there will not be another 4 years for our country. trump and his bullies will pulverize the entire Congress, the Supreme Court and local governmental agencies. The KKK will take over, there will be riots in the streets. Mosques will be bombed. This will lead to buses being bombed. Shit will hit the fan.
Believe Me! This is my prediction if they vote this sociopath into office.
Scary as hell.
Mark
I think you need to seriously reduce your sugar intake, Mark.
I am loving AG. And Jimmy is STARTING to convince me about voting for HRC.
Sorry I meant AP not AG :-)
Yeah, needless to say, nobody loves AG Insurance. :)